Psa new hire
07-09-2021, 10:02 AM
#411
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: CRJ FO
Posts: 4,599
Endeavor just made huge gains without having to give anything up for it. Envoy is currently in contract negotiations. We shouldn’t be negotiating anything. Nada. The negotiating committee should be largely inactive. Let Envoy negotiate. We shouldn’t be looking at any big contractual changes right now. Let the company fix their looming staffing and retention issues on their own. It isn’t our job to help them solve cost issues and it isn’t our job to help them keep the place staffed.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
07-09-2021, 12:44 PM
#412
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2018
Posts: 449
Originally Posted by chrisreedrules
Endeavor just made huge gains without having to give anything up for it. Envoy is currently in contract negotiations. We shouldn’t be negotiating anything. Nada. The negotiating committee should be largely inactive. Let Envoy negotiate. We shouldn’t be looking at any big contractual changes right now. Let the company fix their looming staffing and retention issues on their own. It isn’t our job to help them solve cost issues and it isn’t our job to help them keep the place staffed.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
07-09-2021, 05:42 PM
#413
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2020
Position: F/O
Posts: 60
Originally Posted by Happyflyer
PSA is not offering “the right work rules” Therefore no matter how much you like it wherever you are at, that will not be what PSA gets.
If PSA were able to bundle the cost of SAP into PBS they could get the “right work rules”, but a high tide lifts all boats. Envoy and Piedmont would want to switch to PSA’s PBS and they don’t have the contractual equity via quid pro quo.
They would eventually be in front of an independent mediator who wouldn’t care how PSA got PBS. 3 other large regionals have it, and if PSA sells SAP for it they’d be a fourth, therefore the mediator would easily justify Envoy and Piedmont PBS on par with the industry.
This would force AA to pay for SAP at all 3 WO regionals because once it’s sold for PBS gains it’s no longer an outliner situation.
I would guess AA would offer SAP for 1% flow, but no dollar value to PBS.
The PSA union expects high water to lift all boats, and if Envoy and Piedmont are already at or near 1% flow, then it’s a matter of time for PSA to “party up”, same way Envoy and Piedmont “partied up” when PSA announced new pay rates.
If PSA were able to bundle the cost of SAP into PBS they could get the “right work rules”, but a high tide lifts all boats. Envoy and Piedmont would want to switch to PSA’s PBS and they don’t have the contractual equity via quid pro quo.
They would eventually be in front of an independent mediator who wouldn’t care how PSA got PBS. 3 other large regionals have it, and if PSA sells SAP for it they’d be a fourth, therefore the mediator would easily justify Envoy and Piedmont PBS on par with the industry.
This would force AA to pay for SAP at all 3 WO regionals because once it’s sold for PBS gains it’s no longer an outliner situation.
I would guess AA would offer SAP for 1% flow, but no dollar value to PBS.
The PSA union expects high water to lift all boats, and if Envoy and Piedmont are already at or near 1% flow, then it’s a matter of time for PSA to “party up”, same way Envoy and Piedmont “partied up” when PSA announced new pay rates.
EXACTLY!!! This guy gets it!! Its been the PBS rinse, wash, repeat for now 3 MEC administrations. All 3 MEC's have missed the big industry picture. PSA is not its own airline. PSA sells one ticket a year just one, and that ticket is to AA. What happens at PSA moves the spreadsheet at the other 2 WO.
There is no coincidence that with PSA's previous NC chair JD that PBS was the hill that whole committee would die on while just recently PDT received FLICA.
AA and all the WO mgmts were holding out the whole time expecting ST, and JD, to get PBS done, meanwhile PDT was made to continue their old antiquated bidding process........ST gets removed...Wait sorry "resigned" then PBS talks go to a crawl.......And now magically very recently PDT finally gets FLICA. Cmon Man!!!! ( I got a boat to sell yall in the desert if you dont see it)
SAP was labeled the enemy to the furlough pilots, but it ended up being the contractual block that helped keep us from having an awkward meeting with one of our brothers while "Dad" watched.
ALPA continues to sit around like an Ape eating a banana!
07-09-2021, 06:38 PM
#414
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 774
PSA membership/MEC needs to start a grass roots campaign about flowing on time.
They need to see if they can start informational picketing in CLT airport/Dayton HQ to flow on time.
ST successfully put a pacifier in everyone’s mouth about how he expected flow on the back end of a PBS deal, which effectively raised the stakes of PBS for 3-4 years. Everyone was on pins and needles waiting patiently. No one gives a rats rear end about PBS anymore, the group operates on time and wants flow on par with Envoy and PDT.
Not enough frustration from the group to just modify LOA 5 again from 2/2018 and increase flow.
Lesser of 25% or 5 plus 1 per 125 above 480. The language is already available.
The group should vomit if they have to sit through one more “update” about PBS. Bottom line, you can’t cave and you can’t win, just put it on a shelf.
If Endeavor and Envoy and PDT can flow 1% so can PSA. It’s becoming insulting that local PSA mgmt who state how proud they are of A14 can’t advocate on the groups behalf.
They need to see if they can start informational picketing in CLT airport/Dayton HQ to flow on time.
ST successfully put a pacifier in everyone’s mouth about how he expected flow on the back end of a PBS deal, which effectively raised the stakes of PBS for 3-4 years. Everyone was on pins and needles waiting patiently. No one gives a rats rear end about PBS anymore, the group operates on time and wants flow on par with Envoy and PDT.
Not enough frustration from the group to just modify LOA 5 again from 2/2018 and increase flow.
Lesser of 25% or 5 plus 1 per 125 above 480. The language is already available.
The group should vomit if they have to sit through one more “update” about PBS. Bottom line, you can’t cave and you can’t win, just put it on a shelf.
If Endeavor and Envoy and PDT can flow 1% so can PSA. It’s becoming insulting that local PSA mgmt who state how proud they are of A14 can’t advocate on the groups behalf.
Last edited by Happyflyer; 07-09-2021 at 06:49 PM.
07-09-2021, 07:39 PM
#415
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 428
Originally Posted by chrisreedrules
Endeavor just made huge gains without having to give anything up for it. Envoy is currently in contract negotiations. We shouldn’t be negotiating anything. Nada. The negotiating committee should be largely inactive. Let Envoy negotiate. We shouldn’t be looking at any big contractual changes right now. Let the company fix their looming staffing and retention issues on their own. It isn’t our job to help them solve cost issues and it isn’t our job to help them keep the place staffed.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
If they want to open up Section 6 negotiations early, fine... Let’s talk. Otherwise no more LOAs in my opinion. We should be aiming for Endeavor +5% across the board. I’m fine with PBS if it comes with rigs. I’m not fine with PBS in the hands of what is arguably one of least efficient scheduling departments in the industry and management that is resistant to rigs. Red flags.
07-10-2021, 07:16 AM
#416
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,052
Originally Posted by Chunk
As a former PSA guy, I thought SAP was ‘okay’ it provided flexibility but the need to be off for the SAP day or lose out the following month plus waiting hours for flica to process plus 65 limit took the shine off the Apple. I moved on and now am at a carrier with PBS and I love PBS. *With the right work rules* PBS blows SAP away. I know that’s heretical for Bluestreakers but it’s been the case for me. Much more flexibility
07-10-2021, 08:48 AM
#418
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 428
Originally Posted by payingdues
Whats up with you guys banning PDT crew members from the CLT crew room lol. So silly. Maybe reach out to your higher ups and say this is dumb? We share perfectly fine at PHL?
I'm assuming you're talking about the code change for the E gate offices and crew room? "Have your people talk to our people". The pilots have absolutely ZERO say or impact on any action of this type. Besides, why would you want to hang out upstairs with the gossip girls, the views are much nicer in front of the Florida/Bahama flights. 👌
I do agree with you, kind of a d!ck move if y'all weren't involved and therefore locked out of the premises. There are some secret places to poop in CLT, PM me for the treasure map 😆
Last edited by Throwitaway; 07-10-2021 at 09:00 AM.
07-10-2021, 09:11 AM
#419
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Posts: 373
Originally Posted by Throwitaway
I suggest you take a more "hey guys, not sure if you are aware but your dirt bag management has banned us from the crew room". Rolls off the tongue much better.
I'm assuming you're talking about the code change for the E gate offices and crew room? "Have your people talk to our people". The pilots have absolutely ZERO say or impact on any action of this type. Besides, why would you want to hang out upstairs with the gossip girls, the views are much nicer in front of the Florida/Bahama flights. 👌
I do agree with you, kind of a d!ck move if y'all weren't involved and therefore locked out of the premises. There are some secret places to poop in CLT, PM me for the treasure map 😆
I'm assuming you're talking about the code change for the E gate offices and crew room? "Have your people talk to our people". The pilots have absolutely ZERO say or impact on any action of this type. Besides, why would you want to hang out upstairs with the gossip girls, the views are much nicer in front of the Florida/Bahama flights. 👌
I do agree with you, kind of a d!ck move if y'all weren't involved and therefore locked out of the premises. There are some secret places to poop in CLT, PM me for the treasure map 😆
Hold up. There’s a secret CLT Poop Map!?
07-10-2021, 09:34 AM
#420
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 354
Originally Posted by Throwitaway
I suggest you take a more "hey guys, not sure if you are aware but your dirt bag management has banned us from the crew room". Rolls off the tongue much better.
I'm assuming you're talking about the code change for the E gate offices and crew room? "Have your people talk to our people". The pilots have absolutely ZERO say or impact on any action of this type. Besides, why would you want to hang out upstairs with the gossip girls, the views are much nicer in front of the Florida/Bahama flights. 👌
I do agree with you, kind of a d!ck move if y'all weren't involved and therefore locked out of the premises. There are some secret places to poop in CLT, PM me for the treasure map 😆
I'm assuming you're talking about the code change for the E gate offices and crew room? "Have your people talk to our people". The pilots have absolutely ZERO say or impact on any action of this type. Besides, why would you want to hang out upstairs with the gossip girls, the views are much nicer in front of the Florida/Bahama flights. 👌
I do agree with you, kind of a d!ck move if y'all weren't involved and therefore locked out of the premises. There are some secret places to poop in CLT, PM me for the treasure map 😆
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