Originally Posted by Cujo665

You're "history" is inaccurate.

1(a) Parker offers PSA pilots new CRJ 900 jets in exchange for concessions. PSA Pilots say no, and those jets went to Mesa.

2(a) Parker offers PSA pilots new jets in exchange for concessions. PSA pilots say no and Parker sent those jets to Republic.

HORTON of AMR, during bankruptcy and to create leverage for his $20M buyout demand, sent an ASA for 47 E175, and up to 50 more to RAH; harming AMR stock value and sending a shot across the bow that he'd do more unless he got his way. Parker had nothing to do with it; and those planes were never offered to Eagle.

Eagle/ENY MEC votes no 07-2013
XJT Pilots vote no
Eagle/ENY pilots vote no 03-2014
RAH Pilots vote no 04-2013
SKW gets raises
Commutair gets Raises
Silver gets Raises
ALPA National tells Eagle/ENY we got your back with their letter that they would not allow a whipsaw or a B-scale in August 2013....

Shortly therafter,
3(a) Parker again offers new CRJ 900's to PSA pilots in exchange for concessions, with the caveat that the airline would be shut down if they said no again. PSA pilots took the deal.

1(b) Parker continues to offer Envoy pilots new E-175 jets repeatedly in exchange for concessions. 20 of those jets finally went to Compass on a 6 year ASA when Eagle pilots wouldn't budge on concessions.

3(b) Parker offers ENY again, and again, and again the new E-175's to Envoy pilots. Envoy pilots refused the deal and Parker began to part us out to the lowest bidder (PSA & PDT).

In December it came down to being parted out down to 68 E145's flown by the most expensive and senior pilots in the industry, or take the deal and stop the bleeding.
All of the contracts/plans for our CRJ's and the PDT/XJT/TSA E145 contracts were all done prior to our TA in December. There have been no additional aircraft outsourced since then. In fact, we are pulling them out of storage to add flying that the outsourced companies can't cover.

Originally Posted by MitchRapp

Bold 1: Those were some earth shattering, life changing raises. Skywest got what, a whole buck an hour for FO's? Silver seems to be thriving now since those raises, right?

Bold 2: So you're saying you guys voted in concessions to save your jobs? Where have I heard that before?

The problem isn't the pilots. It's ALPA National. The negotiators of these crap contracts. The fact that National let the local MEC's entertain concessions during record profits is the problem. This crap should have been a non-starter, but National signed off on it anyways.

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

Nice history lesson, but if Eagle stood no chance at getting the original 47 E-jets, why were they so livid at Republic when it happened, how come PSA is the only reason they aren't still ****ed at Republic, how come an Eagle pilot and Republic got in a fist fight in an ORD crew van after that deal was announced?

Originally Posted by pagey

You're missing the point of the post....

In a nutshell:

PSA voted no twice.

Eagle voted no twice.

Originally Posted by Cujo665

Eagle voted no 3 times over 18 months. I missed an MEC vote in my list

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

Nice history lesson, but if Eagle stood no chance at getting the original 47 E-jets, why were they so livid at Republic when it happened, how come PSA is the only reason they aren't still ****ed at Republic, how come an Eagle pilot and Republic got in a fist fight in an ORD crew van after that deal was announced?

Originally Posted by Cujo665

You're "history" is inaccurate.

1(a) Parker offers PSA pilots new CRJ 900 jets in exchange for concessions. PSA Pilots say no, and those jets went to Mesa.

2(a) Parker offers PSA pilots new jets in exchange for concessions. PSA pilots say no and Parker sent those jets to Republic.

HORTON of AMR, during bankruptcy and to create leverage for his $20M buyout demand, sent an ASA for 47 E175, and up to 50 more to RAH; harming AMR stock value and sending a shot across the bow that he'd do more unless he got his way. Parker had nothing to do with it; and those planes were never offered to Eagle.

Eagle/ENY MEC votes no 07-2013
XJT Pilots vote no
Eagle/ENY pilots vote no 03-2014
RAH Pilots vote no 04-2013
SKW gets raises
Commutair gets Raises
Silver gets Raises
ALPA National tells Eagle/ENY we got your back with their letter that they would not allow a whipsaw or a B-scale in August 2013....

Shortly therafter,
3(a) Parker again offers new CRJ 900's to PSA pilots in exchange for concessions, with the caveat that the airline would be shut down if they said no again. PSA pilots took the deal.

1(b) Parker continues to offer Envoy pilots new E-175 jets repeatedly in exchange for concessions. 20 of those jets finally went to Compass on a 6 year ASA when Eagle pilots wouldn't budge on concessions.

3(b) Parker offers ENY again, and again, and again the new E-175's to Envoy pilots. Envoy pilots refused the deal and Parker began to part us out to the lowest bidder (PSA & PDT).

In December it came down to being parted out down to 68 E145's flown by the most expensive and senior pilots in the industry, or take the deal and stop the bleeding.
All of the contracts/plans for our CRJ's and the PDT/XJT/TSA E145 contracts were all done prior to our TA in December. There have been no additional aircraft outsourced since then. In fact, we are pulling them out of storage to add flying that the outsourced companies can't cover.

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

Nice history lesson, but if Eagle stood no chance at getting the original 47 E-jets, why were they so livid at Republic when it happened, how come PSA is the only reason they aren't still ****ed at Republic, how come an Eagle pilot and Republic got in a fist fight in an ORD crew van after that deal was announced?

Originally Posted by MitchRapp

Bold 1: Those were some earth shattering, life changing raises. Skywest got what, a whole buck an hour for FO's? Silver seems to be thriving now since those raises, right?so you're saying raises or status quo are the same thing as bending over and taking concessions? idiot

Bold 2: So you're saying you guys voted in concessions to save your jobs? Where have I heard that before? different circumstances, almost all the scoped out airplanes were already given out. the threat to shut psa down if they didn't take the planes was clearly bogus since they were the first to get approached with the deal. y'all saw an opportunity for personal gain at the expense of every other regional airline pilot, and you took it. Kindly go ******* yourself. Still no excuse for anyone including eagle to vote in concessions.

The problem isn't the pilots. It's ALPA National.wrong, it's both The negotiators of these crap contracts. well, if you think ALPA national is negotiating the details of regional airline contracts, you're a lost cause. ALPA is only a collection of MEC's, PSA's MEC decided to bend over with no lube followed by the selfish pilots.The fact that National let the local MEC's entertain concessions during record profits is the problem. This crap should have been a non-starter, but National signed off on it anyways. National may sign off on it, but they do that after any MEC agrees on anything, the MEC is the real group of people that sign off on anything. Nothing gets past the negotiating table without the MEC's approval, so you either have a bunch of selfish a******s in your MEC or a bunch of cowards.

Originally Posted by daOldMan

Didn't the offer from AAG get worse and worse every time that you voted no? You would think that you would learn over time that if you had voted yes the first time, you would be far better off right now.

Originally Posted by Cujo665

RAH didn't take concessions for those planes. Some Individual pilots may have blamed them, but the real issue back then was the use of the name American Eagle instead of American Connection. We didn't have an MEC back then that would fight for anything. Now we're a brand instead of an airline.