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-   -   Lying pilot recruiters (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/121228-lying-pilot-recruiters.html)

ChecklistMonkey 04-15-2019 03:49 AM


Originally Posted by C37AFE (Post 2803032)
...frontier is not a major per se

It is a major. It is not a legacy.

C37AFE 04-15-2019 05:27 AM


Originally Posted by Excargodog (Post 2803045)
It's a major. Certainly not a top tier one, but their last contract was a substantial improvement.

And it is a place where you can make $110K a year as a second year FO while buffing your resume to attract a job offer from where you really want to be. And if you never get the call, you'll be making $250k a year or better when you eventually retire. Can't say that about many regionals....



You are correct. When I said per se I meant in the legacy terms and I took the op as flows to them as what they where referring to. Even though he said major most consider legacies the majors

Strykerinf 04-15-2019 05:37 AM


Originally Posted by Approach1260 (Post 2803109)
It's not so much that they lie, it's just that they don't tell you the whole truth.

For instance recruiters will tell you PSA has a 5-6 year flow, because pilots on property for that long are currently flowing. Due to growth though a current new hire is looking at closer to a decade to flow because the pilot group is so much bigger than it used to be.

So it's just learning to read between the lines and do your research on your own.


Not all of us actually tell people they will flow in 5-6 years because we all know the math isn’t there to substantiate that claim. I am a recruiter and I am pretty much up front with people about expectations like the flow- it’s an insurance policy... nothing more.. nothing less. I prefer people to make an educated decision on where they want to go based on their needs and whole picture so they don’t eventually get on here and blast the company or the “lying recruiter” that told them XYZ

There are some of us out there that actually care about their company, applicants, pilot group... you just have to find the right one.

rld1k 04-15-2019 05:43 AM


Originally Posted by Strykerinf (Post 2803252)
Not all of us actually tell people they will flow in 5-6 years because we all know the math isn’t there to substantiate that claim. I am a recruiter and I am pretty much up front with people about expectations like the flow- it’s an insurance policy... nothing more.. nothing less. I prefer people to make an educated decision on where they want to go based on their needs and whole picture so they don’t eventually get on here and blast the company or the “lying recruiter” that told them XYZ

There are some of us out there that actually care about their company, applicants, pilot group... you just have to find the right one.

Then why don't you change all the recruiting literature to stop advertising 5-6 yr flow?

havick206 04-15-2019 06:10 AM


Originally Posted by rld1k (Post 2803255)
Then why don't you change all the recruiting literature to stop advertising 5-6 yr flow?

Boom, mic drop.

Strykerinf 04-15-2019 06:57 AM


Originally Posted by rld1k (Post 2803255)
Then why don't you change all the recruiting literature to stop advertising 5-6 yr flow?

You’re basically saying that a private should tell a General how to do their job.. let’s see how that would play out. Not trying to argue, debate, or even defend anyone. I am just saying not all of us lie to people.

C37AFE 04-15-2019 07:52 AM


Originally Posted by Strykerinf (Post 2803306)
You’re basically saying that a private should tell a General how to do their job.. let’s see how that would play out. Not trying to argue, debate, or even defend anyone. I am just saying not all of us lie to people.

The private should definately give advise to the general. They are the ones actually on the front lines. A good general would listen

rickair7777 04-15-2019 08:29 AM


Originally Posted by C37AFE (Post 2803350)
The private should definately give advise to the general. They are the ones actually on the front lines. A good general would listen

A private is 18-19 years old, and trained to maneuver and employ a weapon. He probably has absolutely no insight whatsoever to offer a general.

The general has decades of experience at every level of the military, and insight and experience into all the OTHER things which are required for military operations and the broader security objectives of his nation. He is also educated, with typically advanced degrees, at least one of which will involve geo-politics, strategy, history, etc. Oh, yeah and he fought in the trenches with a bunch of privates when he was a LT. So he already knows. He just needs to make sure he's in tune with the current realities of the front-line troops, because things can change over time, and in different circumstances. But he probably doesn't need advice from a teenager.

"Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics"

havick206 04-15-2019 09:17 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2803368)
A private is 18-19 years old, and trained to maneuver and employ a weapon. He probably has absolutely no insight whatsoever to offer a general.

The general has decades of experience at every level of the military, and insight and experience into all the OTHER things which are required for military operations and the broader security objectives of his nation. He is also educated, with typically advanced degrees, at least one of which will involve geo-politics, strategy, history, etc. Oh, yeah and he fought in the trenches with a bunch of privates when he was a LT. So he already knows. He just needs to make sure he's in tune with the current realities of the front-line troops, because things can change over time, and in different circumstances. But he probably doesn't need advice from a teenager.

"Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics"

Paint it however you want, it’s still false advertising which ever way you cut it.

Meow1215 04-15-2019 09:22 AM


Originally Posted by Cujo665 (Post 2802889)
Honestly, the pilot shortage is just kicking into high gear starting this year.

To the OP, one of the most important things you need to learn and quickly - there is no pilot shortage, there is however a pay shortage.

Don’t let anybody rook you into thinking there is a pilot shortage or that their will be one. There will always been more ATPs than desirable ATP jobs. Been hearing for 30 years, “it’s coming”, “just around the corner”, “this year”. No, there is no pilot shortage. If the pay and QOL are good, that airline has no issues hiring and retaining. If it’s crap with crap work rules - they cannot staff it.

Go somewhere:
1. You can live in domicile
2. Stand being there for up to 5 years
3. Stable flying contracts


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