United Aviate
 

Why did United only include their worst performing and least reliable regionals in their cute new Aviate program?

Is it just a recruiting tool to fill seats at these bottom-feeder airlines since no one would otherwise choose such a poor QOL?

Or is it because they’re UAX-exclusive (aka American & Delta rejects)?

Worst performing defined where?

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I think Mesa is one of the best performing United regionals consistently.

All these regionals have undesirable bases.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...cfd3c99412.jpg

Filler.

I read you could be at United in two years? Is that correct? So everyone at those airlines longer than two years bombed it?

Yes.

It’s a new program, all they have to do now is apply, and successfully complete the interview process. The CJO should include normal background stuff and the 2yrs/2000 hours of service.

I still don't get it, everyone hired prior to Oct 2017 has been passed over?

Some opted out, some didn’t back it twice, some are waiting for their second chance and the rest are on their first try.

I was in the CPP. My timeline was Hogan 5/17, interview 1/18 and butt in the seat 8/19

How long have you been in the industry? Those who don’t know the past are doomed to make the same mistakes.

If you want the Aviate program join on if the Aviate regionals. If you don’t then shut up and color

No, the program has only been around for several months. People prior to now(ish) where eligible under the CPP as highlighted above. The people now who are still on property more than 2 years/2000hours of service either don’t know about the program, haven’t applied, didn’t know pass the interview, or are just not interested in moving on to UAL.

Quick, let’s rebadge it and fluff it up and hope no one realizes that the polished turd is being rolled in glitter.

Somebody is either jealous or had no desire to go to United in the first place.

The latter. Still, the CPP type programs are inferior to a flow in so much as flows are binary in the way they operate.

To put context into my post, I had only about 18 months to go on my flow and moved on to the gig I have wanted for a long time.

Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see anything about the aviate program that’s any different from applying off the street. Please enlighten me as to what advantage the uax pilots are getting?

Not trying to be sarcastic, I’m serious.

The advantage (a huge one) is that they are given the Hogan automatically. For an off the street your application has to be scored and you hope to get the invite. Big advantage.

It was just announced on 10/3/2019, so two weeks.

2yrs/2000hrs is a minimum - it's still going to be seniority based within each regional, so I seriously doubt anyone is going to move anytime soon at 2yrs and 2000hrs.

People who are already at a partner UAX regional have until 12/20 to apply. That group is the 1st wave and within that wave, seniority within your company determines the order that people go (after they pass the assessments, pass the interview, etc, and get a CJO).

After that, it's a first-in-first-out process based on either application date or CJO date (I have not gotten clarity on that question yet).

No goal numbers mentioned other than "10,000 pilots"....

https://unitedaviate.com/

It’s an attempt at the Delta Propel along with the old CPP with a stated goal of being the fastest route to a legacy airline. Soon college kids will have a CJO with UA and will only need 2000 regional hours to move on. It also helps staff the UAX regionals which will help them shrink the amount of flying YX and OO brands that think their pilots are special and not replaceable.

The UA claim is that it will be the fastest path for non-military. But it's light on details, so hard to tell. An allegedly highly-respected airline hiring consultant made a presentation to a class I was in several weeks ago and she said 1700TPIC was competitive at the big 6 for regional non-mil pilots with BS degree. So that's at least 4-5 yrs optimistically. This is probably better. But it looks like a trap for former military who are at a regional to refresh their resume/time.

What I think is a little unnerving is that they are going to interview brand new regional FOs and even trainees just like they would interview a 5+ yr regional CA. And there is now a technical interview aspect. Not sure I'm ready for that interview in the next few months.

You need to look at history. A regional and its performance can be fixed with money. Regionals that have been poor performers (like pinnacle) can be set up as a pipeline/feed to a major. The mainline invests money in the infrastructure and turns the place around (endeavor). I think we’ll see more and more wholly owned regionals in the future with direct paths to that major.

Ok, so you pass the interview and then get your 2 years/2000hrs logged, and then seniority determines the order for who moves on to UA...but at what rate? X-pilots per month? You log 2k hours and then off you go right away? Something else? Is it basically a monthly flow through contingent upon passing the interview?

I have seen this answered yet.

That was the CPP. Aviate says apply, app scored, then invite for the hogan. If your app doesn’t score high enough, you don’t get the Hogan. Same as off the street.

There’s so few concrete details, it’s ridiculous. The aviate website is no help either. Doesn’t list partner 135’s. Whole thing is vague, and seems like a sham that can be changed/pulled at any time.

Well Veruca, probably because of the general attitudes of entitlement like this that have recently been displayed by your pilot groups and are manifested in your post.

Sounds like someone tinkled in your Cheerios. Sorry your 175 didn’t get you a defined pathway to a legacy. Do you have anything valid to add or did you just want to ***** and moan about something you have literally 0 control over? I take that back, you could lateral to one of the included carriers, but that would require a choice on your part.

There is no Hogan on for Aviate. There is a leadership assessment that you take in Denver on interview day.

For non united regionals and 135, my guess is down the road United will let you apply and come to Denver to interview. If you get a yes you can come to United after flying 2k hrs 24 months at a United regional.

You think united would want a pool of United brand experienced pilots and allow all the regionals that fly United to apply. If I end up going to United I would benefit United and hurt the others because I can’t go there now.

Aviate seems like a non wholly owned wholly owned that will be a true wholly owned of United with a flow once the FA’s give up their clause. I think everything’s pointing in that direction and United is trying to get their wholly Owned set up to do just that in the future.

So “the hogan” rebranded as a “leadership assessment?”

No One Knows
 

No one knows how it's going to work.

Not even the people running it.

They've been putting out changes, mistakenly sent stuff out, etc.

Also anecdotally, the percentage for an INTERVIEW accept rate seems higher than the CPP by far, but inexplicably some people you think would get an interview don't.

AFAIK there have been zero interviews, so zero data on that or anything beyond.

I *HOPE* that it is far better than the CPP, which wouldn't be hard, but so far IMHO it's not looking great.

There's SO many ways to not make it in.

It feels experimental. Beta. "Let's see if this works." By the time they get it 'figured out' something more competitive will be required.

Like a real flow.

It's another carrot you may or may not reach.

The best mental attitude is probably: you might not get it, you might not, it's not a real reason to come to a UAX exclusive carrier.

Nice to have if you're here or coming here for other reasons. That's it.

It will also be interesting to see what happens when the economy downturns again.

Money says UAL will ask for it's pilots to flow down to the regionals vs. a furlough.

When that happens, demand CONCRETE language they give something in return. Last time, Continental pulled the ladder up after the flowbacks left is my understanding.

While I agree with a lot of what you said, my guess is that most of the CFI’s getting interviews will get CJO’s. That guarantees them coming to a uax regional.

That’s the only way the uax regionals are going to grow is for young CFI’s to start flocking to them. Also saves them money as they don’t have to improve their contracts. If a guy has a CJO at a major, dependent on him going to said regional, he’s going regardless of the pay/working conditions.

The Hogan is still required, it says on the website.

That’s what I thought. So like I said before, no different than anybody else applying off the street. Looks like it only a win for CFI’s. As it allows you to have an offer at a major before even reaching 1500 hours.

Did anyone else realize Aviate basically has a near 1 year penalty. So basically after being accepted no matter what your status is you have to wait 6 months. So that pushes any of us to May no matter how senior you are. And if you miss those couple classes till summer when UA usually stops hiring you won’t see a classes until what September. A 9 month hold is ridiculous.

Cool, so take your chances off the street then.

Lol I can’t be bummed after recently hitting the previous requirements and now seeing they’ve been pushed out further. Haha tough crowd.

That’s the nature of the beast. Sheesh, pilots will ***** about anything.

There were guys stuck in the regionals for 15 years, you’re not going to find a lot of sympathy about the dream gig taking 6 extra months.

Many of the new people have no clue how bad it was. I heard a new hire student ask his sim instructor “why aren’t you at a major yet? You should be able to go easily!” The instructor has had his app in for years..

Thanks for answering a question nobody asked.

His sim instructor just like other pilots probably doesn’t have a degree. Doesn’t volunteer, the older pilot group doesn’t see the value in volunteering n believe it should be about piloting that’s it. Probably doesn’t have a professional resume. They stop applying!!!! Got comfy with their seniority. Nearing the age of retirement. Doesn’t wanna start over. Zero networking, zero events conventions attended. The older pilot isn’t gonna follow a regional chief pilot on social media and get buddy buddy with him meet for lunch and have him as a
mentor!( GEMS )

Just to name some reasons.

It’s called a job HUNT for a reason. The food doesn’t come to you you gotta get creative.