SIC Logging of Instrument Time
#21
..arrested twice. Made FX network "Cops" for mooning the arresting officer after I failed the field sobriety test. I don't care who you are or how many drinks you've had, there's no way you can touch your nose with....what was I talking about? Anyway, I'm really excited about the opportunity to work for your airline.
#22
New Hire
Joined APC: Apr 2017
Position: C510/C560
Posts: 1
There is an FAA Legal Interpretation on this matter.
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/.../Carpenter.rtf
It doesn't matter what one FDSO says vs another.
As a required SIC, you are allowed to log instrument time, even if you are not the pilot flying. However you can only log the approaches if you were the pilot flying.
"You first ask whether it would be proper under FAR 61.51(g) for a properly qualified SIC to log instrument flight time flown during instrument conditions while serving as the SIC in Part 121 operations on an aircraft that requires two crewmembers. The answer is yes. As a qualified SIC, and as a required crewmember, you are "operating" the aircraft within the meaning of FAR 61.51(g). Therefore, as the SIC operating the aircraft "solely by reference to instruments under actual or simulated instrument flight conditions," you would log that time as SIC flown in instrument conditions. Naturally, the PIC logs the time as PIC flown in instrument conditions.
You then ask if, for the purposes of maintaining instrument currency, an instrument approach on the above flight flown by the PIC can be logged as an instrument approach by the SIC. The answer is no. As the SIC you have not "performed" the approach as contemplated by FAR 61.57(c) because you were not the sole manipulator of the controls during the approach."
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/.../Carpenter.rtf
It doesn't matter what one FDSO says vs another.
As a required SIC, you are allowed to log instrument time, even if you are not the pilot flying. However you can only log the approaches if you were the pilot flying.
"You first ask whether it would be proper under FAR 61.51(g) for a properly qualified SIC to log instrument flight time flown during instrument conditions while serving as the SIC in Part 121 operations on an aircraft that requires two crewmembers. The answer is yes. As a qualified SIC, and as a required crewmember, you are "operating" the aircraft within the meaning of FAR 61.51(g). Therefore, as the SIC operating the aircraft "solely by reference to instruments under actual or simulated instrument flight conditions," you would log that time as SIC flown in instrument conditions. Naturally, the PIC logs the time as PIC flown in instrument conditions.
You then ask if, for the purposes of maintaining instrument currency, an instrument approach on the above flight flown by the PIC can be logged as an instrument approach by the SIC. The answer is no. As the SIC you have not "performed" the approach as contemplated by FAR 61.57(c) because you were not the sole manipulator of the controls during the approach."
I update the link you provided:
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...rpretation.pdf
Thank you!
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2016
Posts: 214
Well, at least I am not alone then. I was in the crewroom the other day and a new hire FO was ecstatic about breaking the "double-digit" actual IFR time. He went on to remark how it is great to be flying 121 and being able to log actual time on each leg. I was left scratching my head wondering if this is a widely accepted practice or if he just didn't know the rules.
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 293
Now I do autolands: who logs that? The SIC is the PF until the PIC takes over and "lands". The AP does the actual approach and landing. Does the SIC log the approach and the PIC log the landing? I don't really care for an answer, but I say both pilots log both approach and landing in autolands. The company gives both pilots currency credit when doing an autoland.
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Standing in front of the tank with a shopping bag
Posts: 918
I just logged in to thank you for the info. This is how all answer should look like, quoting official sources (FARs, links, etc.)
I update the link you provided:
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...rpretation.pdf
Thank you!
I update the link you provided:
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...rpretation.pdf
Thank you!
Got it...
#27
Approaches and LDGs are logged by the person who actually performed them.
The status of the AP (on, off, or broke) is irrelevant. Pilots fly airplanes, the AP is just a tool to help you.
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Standing in front of the tank with a shopping bag
Posts: 918
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12-05-2012 08:29 AM