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Mesa TA

Old 11-11-2008, 03:25 PM
  #11  
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Did the MEC actually recommend this garbage?

I don't have a problem with them letting the pilots vote on this, as long as they recommended a NO vote. The TA being shot down by a wide margin would only serve to strengthen their negotiating position. If the MEC recommended this however, give them the boot.
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Old 11-11-2008, 03:42 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by Dash8Pilot View Post
Did the MEC actually recommend this garbage?

I don't have a problem with them letting the pilots vote on this, as long as they recommended a NO vote. The TA being shot down by a wide margin would only serve to strengthen their negotiating position. If the MEC recommended this however, give them the boot.
the problem is they, as per a conference call think this thing is a good step in the right direction.
We really need MR. ALPA prater to step up and stop this horse****
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Old 11-11-2008, 04:17 PM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by winglet View Post
Pro-rated minimum days off. When availability “is reduced due to Vacation, Non-Recurrent Training or Leave of Absence, or other absences, days of will be prorated”.

Example: In a 30 Day Month; If awarded 7 Days for Vacation; Then original 11 days off are prorated down to five for a total of 12 days off for the month. 12 days off total including Vacation.
I think everything in your post is accurate except your example here. In a 30 day month if awarded 7 days of vacation your 11 days off would be pro rated down to 8 giving a total of 15 days off which as we know is only 4 more than your 11 guaranteed for 7 days of vacation. Magically the company eats 3 vacation days.
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Old 11-11-2008, 05:59 PM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by Airfix View Post
I don't really know those guys that well and I can't really recommend we replace the MEC reps unless I would be willing to step up to the plate and commit to doing the job myself. Which I am not. I've been in a position like that before and I won't be doing it again and certainly not with my current QOL which has much less home time and flexibility than I expected.

Those guys have been working hard for our benefit. They negotiated a contract that we should all reject. That should be a clear message to our MEC to go get what we need.

I'm not sure of the details of the RLA but maybe the MEC want us to vote no to give them more leaverage but they just can't say that due to some constraints I don't know about. I always try to give people the benefit of doubt.
You may not know them personally but you now know their work and what they consider a good contract. As it’s been said, this is a contract of surrender and there should be no surrender with JO.

My friend, you need to talk to some AirTran pilots. After their MEC failed to produce a quality contract they replace them all and started over. You guys need to do the same. After all, you’re not really gaining much with this bottom of the barrel TA so what do you have to lose?
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Old 11-11-2008, 05:59 PM
  #15  
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Thanks Airfix,

You are correct. I changed examples mid-thought and it resulted in an math error. I corrected the math on that post.

Anyway, here is the way the company figured out how to take some vacation days from you.

Prorate Schedule for a 30 day month.

Absent vs. Days Off
0-11
1-11
2-10
3-10
4-10
5-9
6-9
7-8
8-8
9-8
10-7
11-7
12-7
13-6
14-6
15-6
16-5
17-5
18-4
19-4
20-4
21-3
22-3
23-3
24-2
25-2
26-1
27-1
28-1
29-0
30-0

Let's say you use two weeks of your vacation. With the current contract and some creative bidding you can match vacation and theoretically get 24 days off in a 28 day month (14 vacation + 10 line holder min)(86% of the Bid Period).

In this TA the company would now only give you a maximum of six days off in addition to your vacation. So now you would be limited to 20 days off in a 30 day month (14 vacation + 6 prorated)(67% of the Bid Period).

Congratulations! You have just relinquished 4 days off (or 19% of your previous possible vacation). My head hurts! Check my numbers Airfix.

The point really is that the pilot group is being told that this TA is not concessionary when in reality it is nothing but concessions. Especially if (or when) the company decides to cancel PBS and its associated improvements: "Scheduled vs. Actual", Line Guarantee, and Training Bidding would disappear.

Come on people! I have to fly with you. If I hear one person who voted yes complaining , so help me...

I know you are a smart bunch. Do your homework! JUST READ THE TA and call your freinds at the other regional code-shares and compare it to their "concessionary" contracts. You will quickly realize that this TA doesn't even get close.

Vote NO! Send it back! Negotiate a fair contract!

Good Luck...Winglet

-------------------------------------------------------------
“Life is the art of being well deceived; and in order that the deception may succeed it must be habitual and uninterrupted”

William Hazlitt (British Writer, 1778-1830)

Last edited by winglet; 11-11-2008 at 06:09 PM.
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Old 11-11-2008, 06:41 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by AirWillie View Post
Something tells me it's going to be a yes vote. It doesn't take a history major to understand that history repeats itself.
Willie-

Perhaps you are alluding to the previous signing of our current contract.

You see, we took huge concessions to prevent "Freedom Airlines" from remaining separate from "Mesa Airlines" and growing with the 70 and 86 seat flying we were awarded from USAir. We got where we are today because we wanted everyone on one list.

In other words, we prevented an alter-ego airline by signing our current contract.

You know all about alter-ego airlines, since you work for one. Go-Jet.

Your comment about history repeating itself is unfounded and stupid. There is no motivation to sign a less than stellar contract, since things can't get any worse here. No alter-ego airlines, nothing.

A resounding NO from me.

Last edited by paxhauler85; 11-11-2008 at 06:49 PM.
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Old 11-11-2008, 06:57 PM
  #17  
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Push for a 1 hour sign-in.

AE had (has) a 45 minute or 1 hour sign-in.

A 1 hour sign-in is good for everybody, flight-cabin crews, scheduling and your passengers...
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Old 11-11-2008, 08:11 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by SmoothOnTop View Post
Push for a 1 hour sign-in.

AE had (has) a 45 minute or 1 hour sign-in.

A 1 hour sign-in is good for everybody, flight-cabin crews, scheduling and your passengers...
I disagree there is no reason why I should have to "sign in". If I'm a professional I show up for work it's that simple. I don't need to be babysat.
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Old 11-11-2008, 08:14 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by SmoothOnTop View Post
Push for a 1 hour sign-in.

AE had (has) a 45 minute or 1 hour sign-in.

A 1 hour sign-in is good for everybody, flight-cabin crews, scheduling and your passengers...

I would agree to this if it was counted as duty time.

The thing with the 24 hour to 2 hour sign in is it doesn't buy the company anything but it forces me to do something for Mesa on my own time. Let's say I'm commuting the day of my trip but I chose to electronically sign in the day prior because of the 5am early morning commute. Now the company is expecting me.

However if I don't make it on my commuter flights then I'll have to call the company back to tell them now that I won't make it. This call would happen at exactly the same time as it would without this electronic check in so the company is getting nothing extra by forcing me to sign in early.

I argue that we are all professionals and that we should be trusted to give the company as much notice as possible when we cannot make it to work, just like in any other industry. If pilots can't be responsible enough to do that then perhaps they are not the type of people you want working in your company.
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Old 11-11-2008, 08:19 PM
  #20  
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I read the whole TA and as a LAMA I can't believe this is the crap they sent to you.
I remember taking all those surveys on what we wanted in a new contract and this seems to address only one of all my complaints (block or better)
If you Vote no send it back and have a few more things put in:
If PBS gets dropped by the company block or better and line guarantee stays in.
Get rid of the new hire aircraft locks, its garbage that CRJ FO cant bid Dash Capt, or a Dash FO cant bid CRJ FO (there is no reason any junior pilot should be able to hold a hire position or pay than a senior pilot) not without pay protection. And not this one for one crap.
There should be no such thing as Hold back, it should not exist, not one for one, not anything. If you got awarded something you get it when you are suppose to, PERIOD
They should have to turn on the reserve grid on Flica, you get to see the number of pilots on reserve and the buffer, if it is green you get to drop, no exceptions!!!
Drop for IOE, Its dropped, & Pay protected. PERIOD (given that they are going to withhold those trips in PBS that should pretty much eliminate droped for IOE anyways)
Reserve Call out 2 hrs!!!
Minimum pay for getting called out 4hrs
That's all I can think of right now, I will add more when I think of it
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