I just don't see how anyone could ever make this argument. Why do you think civilian guys have more experience flying "in" weather as opposed to military guys? We fly through the same airspace you know ...

 

I'm just back from sim refresher in Europe on teh Q and for those who know the airplane, the INCR REF SPEED was on 95% of the time. That's our "safety" net giving an extra 20KTS margin to the SPS to account for potential icing. AFM says this button should go OFF when out of icing and when wings are clean (or look at the spigots on the windshield wipers).

 

Sound more than right to say that we all fly through the same weather .
But there might be some differences in training between mil and civs tha migth be usefuol to all (?)

 

I would say the difference in training is that the military trains probably 10 times more than the typical civilian airline pilot. Only Uncle Sam has that kind of resources.

In my last aircraft, the pilots and engineers had two emergency and procedure simulator sessions each quarter. They were designed so that after a year of training, the pilots and engineers would have seen (in the sim) every major system on the aircraft and the associated emergency procedures (engines, gear, brakes, hydraulics, electrical, icing systems, windshear, tcas RAs, etc). Each pilot would be given an abort, V1 cut, two-engine landing and go-around, single engine landing, and holding. Each pilot would get at a minimum a precision, non-precision, and RNAV approach.

This was just the "flying the airplane" stuff and doesn't include the training missions were you actually fly the airpane. Also, this doesn't include the tactical and mission oriented procedures, emergencies, and procedures.

I'm not saying one is better than the other ... military pilots just have *a lot* more training.

 

That's interesting KC. On our side, the training program is such that we are every 6 months in the sim and the entire program is over 3 years to review all the emergency situations and checklists. We do not have the same money as Uncle Sam so we are trynig to keep our neurons in good shape:
Hypothetical CVR: "hey I kinda remember I had something like that in the sim 3 years ago. What did we do again?"
I wished we would train more like mils. I does make you more at ease and I personnally enjoy those hard sessions in the sim. I just would like to be sure that if (hope not) a big one happens to me I'll be more than ready for it.
Fly safe.

 

DO NOT turn this into a Mil vs Civ debate ... that is pointless. Both sides bring valuable assets to the table. Enough said ...

GENERALLY SPEAKING ... I agree with the poster that civilians have more experience flying "in" weather.

BUT to clarify, I would go on to say that GENERALLY SPEAKING when comparing civilian to military, if two 35 year-old pilots land a job at a major airline ... the civilian will have at least twice the amount of flight time (and then some) as the mil bubba. Thereby having twice as much time "in the weather" so to speak, since it is all the same airspace as you say ...

That's been my personal experience thus far ... twice.

 

I'm not making this a mil vs. civ argument. My point is, how can you ever say something like that without any hard evidence?

It's been my experience (and my log book shows) that when I fly at my civilian job, I *rarely* ever fly IMC (unless on takeoff or approach) because it usually creates too many bumps for the passengers and we spend a lot of time trying to find clean smooth air for passenger comfort. In the mil, we could care less about the clouds and bumps unless they became a hazard to the mission. In some cases, flying in the weather is good because it provides protection from the bad guys on the ground that are just itching to randomly shoot at something. Of course, this is airframe dependent as I would not expect a fighter pilot to have a lot of instrument time since they seem to like VFR conditions for their operations (just one less thing to worry about when you're single seat flying 400 knots). Additionally, I have flown an overwhelmingly percentage of my mil flights at night, much more so than my civilian job (because I'm not an overnight cargo operator).

 

Good point.

And as we know, the problem for the airlines is training cost$ versus returns.

And to a degree, 10 times more training could be a waste if it hasn't prepared you for the present emergency in the current conditions.

Somewhat of a catch 22 ...

 

The argument Military versus civilian is stupid. Every Pilot's experience is different. Day/Night, VFR/IFR, Hot and Humid/Cold and Dry. Even Pilots who work at the same airline during the same time period can have vastly different experiences. One pilot bids all red eye lines and has a ton of night flying. One senior pilot bids reserve and hardly ever flys. Another bids northeast trips in the winter, while another bids Florida and Mexico. My point is everyone's experience is different. Move on to another argument.

 

I guess not all sims are equal.