Seeing as the last 4-5 fatal accidents in the US were regional’s…

• Colgan – undetermined (potentially icing and lack of icing recognition/recovery training)
• Comair – fatigue, bad crm, checklist procedures
• Corporate Airways – fatigue, bad crm, checklist procedures
• Air Midwest - maintenance

(you could count Pinnacle even though it was a ferry)

It’s not gonna take long before some chucklehead at the associated press puts two and two together and figures out this common thread. Right or wrong the assumption is going to be made that experience/sully = miracle on Hudson. Not so much experience/regional bob = the above. If done right we could take advantage of the media firestorm.

I think 60 minutes might be interested in doing a little special about working conditions at our esteemed carriers. We all know the flying public thinks we're living high on the hog, hell my own best friends thought I was making $80,000 (well I do, every 3 years). A little a media attention and public outrage would go a long way in our fight against the man. Hit john q public with a little john stossel reporting about our lack of training (icing) lack of sleep (reduced rest) lack of pay (less than a bus driver) and all the associated conditions that directly affect performance.

When the flying public gets on a CRJ/ERJ that says United on it, they have little clue we aren’t United pilots and almost zero clue that they’re flying on Skywest, Mesa, GoJets, TSA, Shuttle America, etc... If they knew about the substandard training, maintenance, and potentially unsafe QOL of the pilots (that’s associated with regional carriers) there could be serious hell to pay. If it was only known how cheaply, substandard, and barely reaching FARs a good majority of these companies are run... oh man! And how jackass' like JO are livin the highlife while the foot soldiers that are responsible for hundreds of thousands of lives are palming first class boxes and bottles of water from the plane so they can eat. dude, chaos!!!

I truly believe organizations such as ALPA and RAA primarily exist just to feed themselves. Yeah, ALPA helps us but in the end do they really care about the regionals? Look no further than our awesome quality of life for that answer. What I see on these forums are more than just pilots. I see economic and business gurus, graphic designers, web designers, public relations personalities, and people with heart that truly care… absolutely everything that one needs to go grass roots.

When that waste of space marion blakey sabotaged the QOL and pay for the controllers they launched the Fair FAA and Fly US Safe campaigns and from what I’ve heard they have been quite successful. The total eradication of the BS two tiered pay scale system is on the horizon. Granted a lot of this was financed by NATCA, which in my humble opinion is a lot stronger union. Perhaps some pressure needs to be placed on ours as ALPA is wayyy outta touch with our regional reality.

I see websites, media attention, flight cases with Che Guevara’esk stickers (sub che for a dude in a pilot’s uniform). Maybe I’m crazy but if we even put half the attention that we give *****ing and blaming on these forums into fighting the man we could really make a change.

I even see it as a way to honor our brothers and sisters at Colgan, Comair, etc…

I'm naive, Blast away…

 

Okay you win. All flying will go to mainline. No more regionals.



P.S. You're fired.

 

Over the years, I've seen the press do exactly what you're suggesting on numerous occasions. Although it was easier for the media when there was a bigger distinction between commuter/regional/mainline hardware. With Jetstream 31s and Metroliners, it was generally accepted that a passenger would flown around with a less experienced crew, but now that the difference between regional and mainline has blurred further, the public may not understand the disparity. Ironically, the earlier airplanes were MUCH harder to fly - and there few if any autopilots and those airplanes really required a talent pool. Bet I'm not the only captain who doubts that some of our recent 90day miracle copilots would have ever made through training. But I digress...
I agree that our union could go alot further to raise (positive) public awareness. Not too long ago, UPS cargo was flown by half a dozen different 727 outfits and someone had the presence of mind to force big brown in to making it ONE airline.

 

That’s ridiculous dude… there’s clearly a need for regional’s, but we should at least be compensated like professionals (horizon pay scale at a minimum) and I shouldn’t have to fly planes that require a mechanic to sit jumpseat in order for it to be dispatched and I certainly shouldn’t have a mechanic come into the cockpit and ask me were the ice detector is. The fact of the matter is if these airlines continue to operate the way they do, there's gonna be a lot more fatalities on the way and it could be your ship next. Instead of blaming the average mesa pilot for that fact that you can’t afford a hamburger why don’t you actually do something?

perhaps some hard hitting in your face campaign isnt the way to go, maybe something more positive and subtle. ALPA needs to wake up and help and i think the hard working men/women of this forum can all pitch in. we got all the tools we need right here to at least try and make a difference, if for nothing more than making ourselves feel better.

just opening a discussion... or we could all go back to blaming and griping... your call.

 

I think everyone would say they deserve more pay. Unfortunately, until people either put up(ie, quit or strike) there will always be the low pay and QOL we see now especially at the regionals. And the companies know that. Many people right now are just happy they have a flying job. Either that or they drink the coolaid.

My personal opinion is that pilots are they're own worse enemies. And the cycle will continue. Why wouldn't it? The companies goal is to reduce cost and make a profit. The pilots goals are to fly to build hours to get that "dream job" even if that means suffering with low pay for years, QOL and sacrificing all. And don't forget the public, they just want a cheap ticket! Where is the motivation to pay the crews more money or increase QOL?

 

with people referring to regionals as a potential career, our stays at these lovely companies growing, and the gap between point A and the dream job widening... just how far are we willing to fall?

 

Don't get me wrong Tzadik, I agree with your statements wholeheartedly. The regionals aren't going to be stepping stones, they are going to be careers for alot of people(more so than less). People need to ask themselves what their pain thresholds are in terms of pay, QOL and stability. Unfortunately, too many are willing to keep sacrificing all to keep flying. And the companies know it. Think crack dealer(Airline company) and user(airline pilots). There will always be former(those who have left), current(those flying now) and future users(those who are in training). All look for and believe in that elusive chance to get that high(dream job) that exist somewhere out there for them. The cycle continues...

 

right on man... i knew you weren't anti.

i'm just sayin that if my sentance was 4 years with chance of parole after 3 then boom.... FedEx!!! i could find a way to suck it up and manage.

but if we're gonna be here for 8 maybe 10 years i think we should start doing everything in our power to...

a) make these places safer. its getting ridiculous
b) increase our QOL

where there's numbers there's strength.

like i said above... when stuff went pear shapped for the controllers NATCA took a stand, "across this line you DO NOT!!!". my question is... what do i get for my ALPA dues, an awesome magazine that hits the bin as quick as it shows up in my mail box? calmer than you are

 

Dude. It was a joke. If you can figure out how to save the world more power to you.

 

First off, awesome post and well said. I couldn't agree more. Once upon a time somewhere in the flight levels I was told a true story about how a Pilot (who happened to be the one telling the story) and his Anesthesiologist buddy were talking. When the pilot (a long-time captain at a regional airline) mentioned his pay the Anesthesiologist was blown away. The Anesthesiologist commented on how his job was similar in the fact that it is highly automated, fairly routine and the operator really only gets to show his skill if something goes wrong. He also commented that he only held the life of a couple human beings in his hand on a daily basis whilst the Pilot can hold literally hundreds in his. Yet the Anesthesiologist was making well over $100,000 more a year than the Pilot. This is in essence what I think is wrong with the airline industry. Why is there such a discrepancy here?

WE ARE UNDERPAID!

Don't even get me started on the strength of our union. I am a proud ALPA member, however, I think that the current conditions in our industry (both regional and mainline) prove how weak we've become. We have allowed CEO's and shareholders to walk their way to their G5's and multi-million dollar mansions on OUR backs! Some First Officers in our industry literally qualify for food stamps while their CEO's are busy packing their golden parachutes. No matter how you argue it, that is wrong!

Another enemy for pilots is the FAA. They are completely in cahoots with the airlines. A good example of this is the NTSB's Most Wanted list. For years one of the #1 items has been "Reduce Accidents and Incidents Caused by Human Fatigue - Set working hour limits for flight crews, aviation mechanics and air traffic controllers based on fatigue research, circadian rhythms, and sleep and rest requirements." Yet at many regionals we are still routinely given schedules where reduced rest is scheduled! The NTSB has been trying to persuade the FAA to change it's rules regarding crew rest and scheduling for years, yet the FAA refuses to do so. Why? I thought they were looking out for us and the safety of our passengers? Or could it be that doing so would potentially cause the airlines to hire more crews in order to deal with rest issues which would in turn cost more money... Hmm. I'm sure the FAA has a perfectly good reason reason why they wouldn't make changes that would increase safety . Just look at the Comair accident. Directly attributed to both pilot and controller fatigue. The only reason the FAA doesn't make changes to crew rest and duty requirements is because the airlines lobby Washington so hard that no one has the guts to risk losing funding for their next election. I guess 49 lives is a small price to pay to make sure you get that few extra bucks for a few more TV ads next election season.

Seriously guys this industry is in a sad, sad state. The underground, grass-roots movement that Tzadik suggests is just what we need to start attempting to make some actual change around here. It's obvious ALPA and the other pilot unions are moving at a snails pace if at all on these issues. I really feel that if the public knew exactly what was going on out there, they would force change. We all know the only thing that matters to the people that control our lives is $money$. You start messing with that, and things will change, guaranteed. I'm not sure how to do it, but this thread can be a place for ideas to come together.

We all know things need to change. Let's stand as one and start to force that change!