blastoff

Actually a great idea. Might be the safest solution if no ERJ stairs existed and no one could operate the jetway. Better than my idea of sending people down a belt loader.
That would probably get you both fired and certificates pulled. (Mashalling OK, Single-pilot taxi...not so much)
Agreed.

Kudos to you actually offering solutions instead of casting stones. As far as people being upset that "we're doing the same thing to rampers," I can say specifically that they didn't know their SIDA procedures and lacked common sense. That said, we're talking about minimum wage workers and expecting them to run an airport. They control things because, over time, we pilots have allowed them to.

ImperialxRat

I would assume that maybe the serverly foul weather that was preventing them from departing was also preventing the crew from hopping out of the plane to go try and find any ramp or office people...

Running around on a ramp in the middle of a severe thunderstorm will probably get ya struck by lightning.

Was the weather foul the whole time they were stuck there?

bored

I just might have taken the risk of running into the building, as the Captain to get things done. As I mentioned before in a previous post, I would have rolled up my sleeves and gotten dirty instead of trying to manage my airplane from a radio.

Semantics... I know, but they're not minimum wage earners. That's not the point. Who are we to judge the crew when we weren't there? Who are we to judge the ramp staff, when we weren't there? The wages they earn shouldn't separate the lines of respect from the folks who weren't even there.

Airsupport

They would have a hard time firing someone for delcaring an emergency and doing what needed to be done under pic authority to get those passengers off the plane safely. You could easily defend sending the fo out to marshal the plane in and taxiing the plane up single pilot. "Under pic authority and for the safety of the aircraft and my passengers I felt as captain that it was necassary for the fo to marshal us in and get us in a position to deplane the passengers while still protecting the plane from possbile structural damage. It was my professional opion that this was the safest and most reasonable option available at the time." At that point it is an emergency. No food, no water, no working toilets, women and children, all would add up to emergency pic authority.

blastoff

This is an interesting one. It would be nice if some regulator type would just tell us what we can and can't do. If we had a real emergency, I would be more inclined to just have everybody egress the aircraft and not risk operating the aircraft out of ops specs even after declaring an emergency.

Even using "emergency authority" I think a regulator would still try to get you for self-parking with one pilot upstairs. Although, it would be the easiest thing since I'm sure there are a lot of FO's who worked ramp/FBO jobs and could easily handle the ground stuff.

spank

Well put, I've already discussed the situation with a number of captains and they stated if push came to shove, they'd exercise "pic authority" and get the pax off the plane. Where there's a will there's a way. I for one would not let myself let alone the passengers I'm responsible sit on a ramp for that long. Period.

say that again

This is what happens when we let captain's authority erode under some overachieving terminal misfit. Remember, we're the final authority, contrary to who says what in the terminal. The buck stops with the captain. I'm surprised someone didn't "smell smoke" and initiate an evacuation.

Airsupport

If you have an emergency then your opspecs, the far's, and all other rules governing the flight go out the window and you must choose to do what it will take to make sure this flight ends with the best possible out come. For example when they landed the plane on the Hudson I am sure that was not in their opspecs approval. He decided that it would give them the best possible outcome at that moment in time and did what he needed to do to make it happen.

Also when the captain died on the continental flight they didn't stop on the runway. The FO took the plane all the way to the gate. I am sure there was another pilot on board but I dont think that in their opspecs it says that the fo can taxi the plane to the gate. I am sure he declared an emergency and did what needed to be done. No need to evacuate the plane on the runway just because there was no captain on board to do it.

Maybe that is whats wrong. People dont know what Captains authority is and therefore dont know how to use it.

pjflyer

This is great news for XJT and the crew, but still is NOT acceptable. The FBO option would have most likely worked with NO chance of an injury. As someone stated, all it takes is a ladder. Every FBO has a ladder and this crew could of been praised instead of questioned by all of us and the passengers. You're telling me there are CA's out there that will let a ramper or operations person tell them they have to leave the pax stuck all night, how sad! We all need to remember it's all about the people in the back, #1. From making PA's every 15 mins (max), to being on time, and most importantly keeping everyone safe, it's all important. I have worked at many FBO's and all of them (even small) would welcome an airliner if it meant keeping people safe and happy until the morning. I thought all crews knew that you DO NOT have to deplane into a secure area on a domestic flight. It would only be applicable if re-boarding or leaving the gate area. So taxi to the FBO, deplane, have some cookies and re clear in the morning at the terminal. Most of the passengers would have been picked up or rented a car. Again, sounds like intentions were good but there was no hero CA here.

blastoff

The relief pilot (it was an augmented crew) who was Left-Seat qualified taxied to the gate.