Deal made on hours of training for co-pilots
#101
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: CFI
Posts: 416
Have you seen the unrest taking place in those countries where high union wages dominate? The Western European countries have highly paid pilots and their economies are failing or stalled at best. Just look at England. BA is set for a three day strike and Greece is falling apart. Higher wages in the foreign countries may not be all they're cracked up to be.
#102
Have you seen the unrest taking place in those countries where high union wages dominate? The Western European countries have highly paid pilots and their economies are failing or stalled at best. Just look at England. BA is set for a three day strike and Greece is falling apart. Higher wages in the foreign countries may not be all they're cracked up to be.
#103
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Position: A320 eff oh
Posts: 277
Couldn't disagree more!
The Colgan crash families are operating under the false premise that politicians can fix this. (Whenever I've had a Mx problem, I always ask a gate agent to fix it)
Let's see if I got this right?
Renslow and Shaw both met every single requirement that's been proposed thusfar, (ATP's, 800-1,500 hours, multi-crew training, airline approved training for icing conditions, etc.) Neither one was a zero-to-hero at Colgan.
What would prevent this from happening again? Shut down places like Gulfstream and go up the rectum of Colgan's training department with a microscope, and put shady operators and the RAA on notice.
The families mentioned laud this STUPID proposal, and in turn enable the very pay-to-play places like Gulfstream that produced a pilot like Renslow. I'm I the only one who thinks the ATP and 800hour/icing compromise have nothing to do with this accident? I'm insulted that obviously not a single pilot is being consulted on this p.o.s. legislation?
The Colgan crash families are operating under the false premise that politicians can fix this. (Whenever I've had a Mx problem, I always ask a gate agent to fix it)
Let's see if I got this right?
Renslow and Shaw both met every single requirement that's been proposed thusfar, (ATP's, 800-1,500 hours, multi-crew training, airline approved training for icing conditions, etc.) Neither one was a zero-to-hero at Colgan.
What would prevent this from happening again? Shut down places like Gulfstream and go up the rectum of Colgan's training department with a microscope, and put shady operators and the RAA on notice.
The families mentioned laud this STUPID proposal, and in turn enable the very pay-to-play places like Gulfstream that produced a pilot like Renslow. I'm I the only one who thinks the ATP and 800hour/icing compromise have nothing to do with this accident? I'm insulted that obviously not a single pilot is being consulted on this p.o.s. legislation?
#104
Hi!
TPROP4ever:
What are you advocating for here???...
Do you want Congress to disband the FAA, or just tell the FAA that they can't regulate how pilots enter into commercial aviation?
Without a government entity to regulate air safety, you think that each airline's management (in conjunction with their unions, if they have any) should regulate their own operation???
cliff
NBO
TPROP4ever:
What are you advocating for here???...
I tried to caution people that trusting any government entity to regulate entry into a field they know little about could bite us all in the butt.
Without a government entity to regulate air safety, you think that each airline's management (in conjunction with their unions, if they have any) should regulate their own operation???
cliff
NBO
#105
And many times what will a single sim tell you about a pilot?
How about a sim or a flight in an airplane that I've never been in before?
Will that be a fair assesment of my piloting skills?
How about if I told you that I would give you your DREAM job if you could pass a basic instrument qualification in MY simulator? I'm sure that I could make it more than you can handle 99% of the time.
No....training is actually a much better gauge of a pilot's skill than a one shot simulator session.
USMCFLYR
How about a sim or a flight in an airplane that I've never been in before?
Will that be a fair assesment of my piloting skills?
How about if I told you that I would give you your DREAM job if you could pass a basic instrument qualification in MY simulator? I'm sure that I could make it more than you can handle 99% of the time.
No....training is actually a much better gauge of a pilot's skill than a one shot simulator session.
USMCFLYR
#106
Agreed, good training is the best case scenario! And I also agree that one sim session can't tell you much about how good of a pilot someone is, although it could certainly tell you how bad they are. I'm definitely not saying that the sim ride should be "more than you can handle", that would be worthless. I don't think a few approaches and some partial panel is "more than you can handle". At least it shouldn't be if you are trying to be an airline pilot. All I'm saying is it seems that the sim ride is so easy the way it is for some interviews that it is nearly pointless.
I don't know what these airline interview sim sessions are like - so it is very hard (impossible really) to say that they are an appropriate test (evaluation) of one's skill level. You pros will have to judge that.
I'll focus on my feelings for any future sim eval that I might have to endure. I'm pretty confident in my instrument skills - in my airplane. I'm not looking forward to having to fly an airplane that I am unfamiliar with, shooting approaches that I am either unfamiliar with, or at least haven't shot in many, many years, and have a job that I would really like to have hanging in the balance.
The good side of the equation is that I am pretty sure that through my career I have proved that I am trainable. I'm sure I have my work cut for me - but I keep telling myself that if those 300 hr wonders can do it - THEN SO CAN I! (and I mean make it through any training program - not just a 121 airline training program)
USMCFLYR
#107
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Posts: 691
Have you seen the unrest taking place in those countries where high union wages dominate? The Western European countries have highly paid pilots and their economies are failing or stalled at best. Just look at England. BA is set for a three day strike and Greece is falling apart. Higher wages in the foreign countries may not be all they're cracked up to be.
#108
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2009
Posts: 187
So they trust that since the FAA signed off on 250 hour wonders flying right seat, its just fine (or in most cases ignorance is bliss). But when fully informed of what having said 250 hour wonder entails after a catastrophic accident, then they and the equally ignorant politicians look at it as "well the experts obviously didn't do things right and so now we will step in to rectify the situation". .
#109
That would be Colgan 3407 just outside of Buffalo. I am sure this is where you will point out the Captain had over 3000 hours total, but that doesn't change one simple fact about his experience. He was hired at his first airline job as a 250 hour pilot.
#110
Exactly right! And if you ever have an accident/incident, your total hours acquired at your first job (instructor/cargo/banner towing/ ferry pilot, etc) should be the determining causing factor!!
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