|
Eagle Life
Can someone elaborate on the life at Eagle? How is reserve? #of days off on reserve, short-call long-call etc... Any contractual days off required? Ex: OH guarantees 4 in a row 3 in a row per bid period.
|
once you are out CS adds to your sked rather than call out. very little control for the senior reserves, none for the juniors.
|
Originally Posted by heading180
(Post 778741)
Can someone elaborate on the life at Eagle? How is reserve? #of days off on reserve, short-call long-call etc... Any contractual days off required? Ex: OH guarantees 4 in a row 3 in a row per bid period.
|
Decade upgrade, so plan to be poor for a long time. 11 days off a month on RSV, you either have airport ready which is usually from 0600-1400 or 1400-2200, or you will have a 2 hour call out from home/crashpad. And I believe the answer to your last question is, they do a max of 6 days in a row with a day off between those sequences. It depends on what base or equipment you choose/get that will determine how much flying you do, I'd keep asking different people if you can on their experiences. Overall the crews you fly with are great people that are dedicated in providing good service, sometimes you get unlucky and fly with complete pricks who think they are the 5 stripe commanders and gods gift to flying, all depends on the day I guess..
I'm not trying to be the debbie downer guy, but unless your looking to make Eagle your career airline or if you will be home based, I wouldn't recommend joining Eagle due to the lack of career progression here. I do not know your current situation/age/background so only take my views with a grain of salt and see what fits for you. Just from my experiences and with my career goals in mind(majors if they still exist in the future), I wish I would have gone elsewhere when I had the opportunity just due to the lack of career progression here. |
Reserve is tough no matter how you swing it. I was on reserve for my first year at Eagle before getting furloughed. I plan on being on reserve for at least another year. I was the junior guy in the company so I was the last at each base I went to which made my situation a little more painful.
If you live in base it can be bearable, if you commute, get a crashpad. Flying when I was on reserve was scarce. The most I flew in a month was 55 hours. I average 25 hours with as little as 8 hours one month. Like people said you end up with 5-6 day stints which blow if you're doing ready reserve (sitting at the airport). Ready's do not fly. They are used as a last resort. If you hold a ready line be prepared to sit in the crew room each day. Junior guys on call got more flying b/c CS worked from the bottom up on the list. Senior guys usually did not fly but they preffered that most of the time. The sweet spot I think is the top 25% of the list. These guys can sit at home if they want and not get called unless there is the perfect storm, but they can proffer for open trips and usually get them. With all the hiring going on and change in flying I think that reserve will play out a little different then I experienced but being on the bottom is being on the bottom. The best advice I can give to guys joining me on reserve is to figure out and adapt quickly. Find a way to use the system to your advantage (what little advantage there may be), learn the ins and outs of the SABRE system so you know when you can expect to fly or expect to sit around and wait. Also find ways to pass the time in the crashpad or at the airport. A lot of flying I got on reserve would be 2-3 deadhead legs to fly 1 leg. It sounds ridiculous but happened to a lot of guys. Patience will be your best virtue. |
The problem I ran into a lot was not that scheduling would use me once I got called it was that they'd use me for a turn and then release me.
After commuting in for a 6 day stint the last thing I'd want to do is sit around so I'd beg to fly and try to build things together. The best scenario is to end up on an overnight each night of reserve. Never happened though. I'd get called in KLGA to do a KPIT turn every saturday morning which was always my first day there one month. I'd have commuted in the night before on my day off to get there for 0400 RAP or S1. I'd finish the turn by 1100 am and be released. I couldn't exactly commute home b/c I'd then be in the cycle for the 0400 RAP or S1 for the next few days. I wish they flew me more. Hopefully it'll be a bit busier this year. |
Originally Posted by withthatsaid182
(Post 778783)
I'd get called in KLGA to do a KPIT turn every saturday morning which was always my first day there one month. I'd have commuted in the night before on my day off to get there for 0400 RAP or S1. I'd finish the turn by 1100 am and be released. I couldn't exactly commute home b/c I'd then be in the cycle for the 0400 RAP or S1 for the next few days.
|
Originally Posted by FLowpayFO
(Post 778766)
Decade upgrade, so plan to be poor for a long time. 11 days off a month on RSV,
|
Originally Posted by withthatsaid182
(Post 778782)
Reserve is tough no matter how you swing it. I was on reserve for my first year at Eagle before getting furloughed. I plan on being on reserve for at least another year. I was the junior guy in the company so I was the last at each base I went to which made my situation a little more painful.
If you live in base it can be bearable, if you commute, get a crashpad. Flying when I was on reserve was scarce. The most I flew in a month was 55 hours. I average 25 hours with as little as 8 hours one month. Like people said you end up with 5-6 day stints which blow if you're doing ready reserve (sitting at the airport). Ready's do not fly. They are used as a last resort. If you hold a ready line be prepared to sit in the crew room each day. Junior guys on call got more flying b/c CS worked from the bottom up on the list. Senior guys usually did not fly but they preffered that most of the time. The sweet spot I think is the top 25% of the list. These guys can sit at home if they want and not get called unless there is the perfect storm, but they can proffer for open trips and usually get them. With all the hiring going on and change in flying I think that reserve will play out a little different then I experienced but being on the bottom is being on the bottom. The best advice I can give to guys joining me on reserve is to figure out and adapt quickly. Find a way to use the system to your advantage (what little advantage there may be), learn the ins and outs of the SABRE system so you know when you can expect to fly or expect to sit around and wait. Also find ways to pass the time in the crashpad or at the airport. A lot of flying I got on reserve would be 2-3 deadhead legs to fly 1 leg. It sounds ridiculous but happened to a lot of guys. Patience will be your best virtue. Everyone flies and we run out of RSV's everyday. At least in DFW. |
Im in the top 20% of RSvs at ORD. I live in base. Shuffle between composite and RSV. Extensions are the worst when it comes to being on RSV. I can proffer to know a little bit, but once you are in the system it is not uncommon for them to extend you for 2 to 3 more days. For example, last weekend I proffered for a 2 day tip I came home 3 days later.
|
Eagle is what you make of it. There are ways to take advantage of the system if you want to. If you live in base being on the bottom of the reserve list can still be managable. Unlike most places reserves can pick up open time. So you can drop two days of reserve and then turn around and pick up a 7-8 hour day trip on one of the days you dropped. On reserve you make 3:54 per day so if you drop two days and pick up a trip worth 7:48 you get one more day off and don't lose any pay. Do that four times a month and you have gone up to 15 days off, converted 4 days that you were on reserve to a schedule you know about in advance and are left with 11 days of reserve. Some guys who live on sabre have been known to trade drop and pickup to the point where they basically made their own line, and these were guys on the bottom third of the reserve list.
When profering for trips the trick is to get a trip with an 8 hour flying day on the last day or a late return on the last day. Profering for a trip that ends at 7 or 8 in the morning is asking to get extended. Profering for a trip that gets done late or has 3-5 legs the last day will more than likely have you getting released once you are finished. If you live locally and want to just do turns DO NOT proffer for a 10:00am MKE turn out of ORD. I know someone who did that and that turn became a 5 day trip. Also don't forget if you are extended over and over and get Fatigued, Eagle has a no fault fatigue policy. You will not lose pay over calling in fatigued. I have called in 5 times and havn't lost a penny. |
Originally Posted by shfo
(Post 779262)
Eagle is what you make of it. There are ways to take advantage of the system if you want to. If you live in base being on the bottom of the reserve list can still be managable. Unlike most places reserves can pick up open time. So you can drop two days of reserve and then turn around and pick up a 7-8 hour day trip on one of the days you dropped. On reserve you make 3:54 per day so if you drop two days and pick up a trip worth 7:48 you get one more day off and don't lose any pay. Do that four times a month and you have gone up to 15 days off, converted 4 days that you were on reserve to a schedule you know about in advance and are left with 11 days of reserve. Some guys who live on sabre have been known to trade drop and pickup to the point where they basically made their own line, and these were guys on the bottom third of the reserve list.
When profering for trips the trick is to get a trip with an 8 hour flying day on the last day or a late return on the last day. Profering for a trip that ends at 7 or 8 in the morning is asking to get extended. Profering for a trip that gets done late or has 3-5 legs the last day will more than likely have you getting released once you are finished. If you live locally and want to just do turns DO NOT proffer for a 10:00am MKE turn out of ORD. I know someone who did that and that turn became a 5 day trip. Also don't forget if you are extended over and over and get Fatigued, Eagle has a no fault fatigue policy. You will not lose pay over calling in fatigued. I have called in 5 times and havn't lost a penny. Might want to check that. I've heard there are times when it's true, and times when it's not... I think it depends on how much you had already flown that day before getting FTG... at least that's how it used to work. |
Originally Posted by shfo
(Post 779262)
So you can drop two days of reserve and then turn around and pick up a 7-8 hour day trip on one of the days you dropped.
You may wanna check into this too. I really don't think you can pick up any flying on a RSV day you dropped. Tried that and the person I had for CS on that day said no. |
The main problem with Eagle reserve was that the nigth before you started reserve you would know what RSV coverage you had until 3pm Pacific time. Since I commuted from SEA that made getting to base a Charlie Foxtrot. I guess that it really wasn't made for the commuter. Also, we were so short staffed that they would DH pilots from other bases to come in and do the flying while RSV in the base would sit and not get called. Good for people who lived in base but bad for commuters that wanted to fly instead of sleep on the crewroom couch.
|
Originally Posted by Mason32
(Post 779362)
Might want to check that. I've heard there are times when it's true, and times when it's not... I think it depends on how much you had already flown that day before getting FTG... at least that's how it used to work.
You may wanna check into this too. I really don't think you can pick up any flying on a RSV day you dropped. Tried that and the person I had for CS on that day said no Depends on the base, aircraft, seat, staffing and scheduler. At the begining of the month they approve drops based on a staffing number, they then usually block all the open time. As the month goes on and the staffing goes down they'll unblock usually only a couple of days before the sequence is to begin. If staffing is really tight they will let you pick it up. Seen it many times. It's a gamble but it can pay off. |
Last year I remember sitting reserve and not flying at all because CS was deadheading in DFW and ORD crews to do our flying and this way the numbers in NY looked better i.e. adequate staffing. I would see a 3 day open up and then watch a DFW crew come in and CS's logic was that they needed for AM standby the next day blah blah blah. For awhile some guys in ORD would drop their entire month and pick up OT around the system. Again taking flying away from guys in their base. I don't care what the system allows you to do or what your seniority allows you to do it was garbage. Eventually they blocked OT and stopped approving guys who requested to drop an entire month.
|
And then there is the DH from SJU to cover an over nite in a DFW outstation - lots of "middle seat" time.
|
Originally Posted by mwa1
(Post 779554)
And then there is the DH from SJU to cover an over nite in a DFW outstation - lots of "middle seat" time.
|
Originally Posted by withthatsaid182
(Post 779459)
Last year I remember sitting reserve and not flying at all because CS was deadheading in DFW and ORD crews to do our flying and this way the numbers in NY looked better i.e. adequate staffing. I would see a 3 day open up and then watch a DFW crew come in and CS's logic was that they needed for AM standby the next day blah blah blah. For awhile some guys in ORD would drop their entire month and pick up OT around the system. Again taking flying away from guys in their base. I don't care what the system allows you to do or what your seniority allows you to do it was garbage. Eventually they blocked OT and stopped approving guys who requested to drop an entire month.
What the heck happened to your contract? They never used to be able to do this. They had to use in base reserves before bringing in guys from other bases. Matter of fact, when you went back through the base if they then had in-base reserves, they had to replace you and send you back to your base....When did you guys lose this and what did you get for it? and when did they start blocking open time? is that what it sounds like, a line holder, or RSV, can't pick up a trip that is open? What did you guys get for that one? That's HUGE... it lets them fly their reserves and avoid paying overtime premium, unless they think they'll need to. Wow, things have gotten bad. Can you guys still turn down certain reassignments under the JIC? or did that get lost too? Next you'll see Eagle copying mainline and trying to open codomiciles.... |
Originally Posted by Mason32
(Post 780435)
What the heck happened to your contract?
What's really funny is how many of our post-1997 hire pilots think it's not such a bad contract. They are going to get an education when we have our first Section Six contract negotiations in 2013. Unfortunately, unless they plan on going back to their floor manager job at JCPenney, most of them will still be here. |
Originally Posted by Mason32
(Post 780435)
Next you'll see Eagle copying mainline and trying to open codomiciles.... |
Withthatsaid182,
Your experience on RSV was quite abnormal due to overstaffing (and is why you ended up furloughed). I think we are pretty much back to normal now - which is slightly understaffed with all reserves flying a lot each month, and with plently of extensions resulting in 5 and 6 day trips, in most statuses. |
there is no life at eagle and it is certain that it will be sucked out of you before you can leave! :)
|
Originally Posted by Beagle Pilot
(Post 780443)
It's the same 1997 contract plus four no strike/no lockout, 5 item arbitration choice amendment rounds. The best part of it was a minimum pay raise which prevented us from taking a pay cut. If the rest of the industry hadn't sunk so far down, we'd be at the bottom instead of floating around the middle.
What's really funny is how many of our post-1997 hire pilots think it's not such a bad contract. They are going to get an education when we have our first Section Six contract negotiations in 2013. Unfortunately, unless they plan on going back to their floor manager job at JCPenney, most of them will still be here. What about the ability to decline reassignments in certain circumstances under the JIC, joint Implementation Committee.... did that go away too? |
Originally Posted by swaayze
(Post 780648)
Withthatsaid182,
with all reserves flying a lot each month, and with plently of extensions resulting in 5 and 6 day trips, in most statuses. which is not a bad thing sometimes, 150% pay |
Originally Posted by swaayze
(Post 780648)
Withthatsaid182,
Your experience on RSV was quite abnormal due to overstaffing (and is why you ended up furloughed). I think we are pretty much back to normal now - which is slightly understaffed with all reserves flying a lot each month, and with plently of extensions resulting in 5 and 6 day trips, in most statuses. |
Originally Posted by mwa1
(Post 780698)
there is no life at eagle and it is certain that it will be sucked out of you before you can leave! :)
|
Originally Posted by meeko031
(Post 780866)
which is not a bad thing sometimes, 150% pay
|
Originally Posted by AmericanEagleFO
(Post 780902)
Not when you are on rsv. Then you just bend over and take it.
|
Life @ Eagle isn't bad as an FO on the CRJ in DFW. I live in base. Fly no more than 55 hours a month (more commonly 30-40 hours). Only away from home 3-5 nights a month.
I've never gone over guarantee while on reserve since I've been here (10/07 hire). Most ever was 55 hours back in Spring 08. For the record I am far from senior on RSV...very...very far. Now those on the ERJ....phew...they get worked much harder. |
Hows Reserve in ORD? One airplane better than the other>?
|
Its been a while (2007) but when I was at Eagle I did not find it too onerous.
I was on reserve for about 6 months, 3 in LGA, 3 in BOS (I live in HYA), then held a line. My commute to NY was never that hard. I was rarely hot reserve in LGA, but I was not the most junior (I was #3 from the bottom, the Junior guy was always hot reserve). I knew what CS was going to do to me, about 85% of the time. I could proffer for the open trips I wanted. I could move my RSV days around, and make many family functions. The crews were without exception excellent. Lots of upside. Before Eagle I was at PSA, commuting to CLT, no idea what CS was going to do to me. (Couldn't see how many reserves were there, how many trips were uncovered, couldn't proffer for trips). 18 months reserve, with no apparent movement. Eagle was a much better place for me. A current coworker was at Eagle, moved to ExpressJet and found the conditions in IAH more to his liking. In short, there are worse places to be(some much worse). But commuting to sit reserve is awful no matter where you work. |
Could an Eagle pilot tell me if you guys have any type of long-call reserve at over there? A copy of the CBA would be very nice too :) I've got the job offer and weighing my options.
Brian |
Originally Posted by brottman
(Post 845565)
Could an Eagle pilot tell me if you guys have any type of long-call reserve at over there? A copy of the CBA would be very nice too :) I've got the job offer and weighing my options.
Brian |
Originally Posted by stillageek
(Post 781109)
Life @ Eagle isn't bad as an FO on the CRJ in DFW. I live in base. Fly no more than 55 hours a month (more commonly 30-40 hours). Only away from home 3-5 nights a month.
I've never gone over guarantee while on reserve since I've been here (10/07 hire). Most ever was 55 hours back in Spring 08. For the record I am far from senior on RSV...very...very far. Now those on the ERJ....phew...they get worked much harder. I'm on the EMB, 7-year pay, live in base, gone maybe 8 nights per month, pick up very little OT, and I am on track to make about $55,000 this year. Life can be better at Eagle. Just my 2 cents. By the way, I commuted to reserve for a long time and I still had a decent quality of life. If you know the work rules, you can find ways to bend them in your favor. Not everyone hates working for Eagle. |
Originally Posted by jettune1
(Post 782071)
Hows Reserve in ORD? One airplane better than the other>?
|
Originally Posted by Royer
(Post 845939)
I'm on the EMB, 7-year pay, live in base, gone maybe 8 nights per month, pick up very little OT, and I am on track to make about $55,000 this year.
Clearly I need a lesson. I'm on year 6, do about the same number of overnites but lately try to add 10-15 hrs OT and still am lucky to hit 90-95 most months (resulting in about 45k if I could do it consistently, which doesn't seem to happen). Next month's line is 2-day trips worth 75hrs. Doubt I'll get to 90 hrs with OT. |
Bid into transition conflicts. I got 107 hours credit in February while only flying 78.
|
Anyone getting hired now will be furlough fodder if not furloughed by the end of next year.
Any junior folks left after that can kiss it good bye if we're bought. And any one after that...well how bout that contract coming up. :) |
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:15 PM. |
User Alert System provided by
Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) -
vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Website Copyright ©2000 - 2017 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands