AE to get E175's?
02-10-2012 | 01:20 PM
#61
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From: NA
02-10-2012 | 01:45 PM
#62
I'm a man of my word.
Joined: Jul 2008
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From: Devil's Advocate
Originally Posted by hesitant
Thanks for wishing me luck on my job hunt. I am going to need it. My plan is to stick it out and and not quit like you did.
Why don't we stop arguing. I will try to be nicer if you can try to be smarter.
Why don't we stop arguing. I will try to be nicer if you can try to be smarter.
Quit like me, huh? Yeah, getting furloughed is exactly like quitting. How about you go take a long walk off a very short pier. And I've seen that sticker too. As I've said before, your posts lack ingenuity.
Last edited by CaptainCarl; 02-10-2012 at 02:06 PM.
02-10-2012 | 01:47 PM
#63
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From: back in the right
Too many IMHO.....at least in EVERY hub. I think AMR will get a lot of what they want on scope. There will be more RJ's and larger RJ's and multiple carriers, but 4 in each hub seems too many. How many more and how larger will be the question. Not every regional will operate in every hub and I'm also betting turboprops like the Q400 are somewhere in the mix. If AMR does indeed grow AA as well as they are promising, then RJ jobs would go to the pilot group that bids/flies them. But a low-bidder/whipsaw scenario makes for a lousy career. The key for us AT THE VERY LEAST, is to ensure that if RJ growth DOES come at the expense of mainline jobs (like the past), then those who lose jobs get protections by virtue of captains positions on the RJ's. That is at the very LEAST.
If it's AMR's intent to simply outsource to that degree, there's nothing left to save or fight for, for the bottom half of the AA list. Any deal like that simply will result in the bottom half recognizing that (along with many captains who'd become F/O's.......potentially for the remainder of their careers, considering their age), that a vote on any such TA would be no by the majority forcing AMR to proceed with their "plan" with their pilots under a contentious work order and its resulting bedlam. At that point, I think their reorganization plan would fail due to uncertainty and lack of confidence and merger/fragmentation would occur quicker. Considering the history of this company and management, I simply cannot and will not give any blind trust to promises and any "yes" vote on a TA will have to give me confidence in job security. I'll vote no without that, the cos
equences be damned.
If it's AMR's intent to simply outsource to that degree, there's nothing left to save or fight for, for the bottom half of the AA list. Any deal like that simply will result in the bottom half recognizing that (along with many captains who'd become F/O's.......potentially for the remainder of their careers, considering their age), that a vote on any such TA would be no by the majority forcing AMR to proceed with their "plan" with their pilots under a contentious work order and its resulting bedlam. At that point, I think their reorganization plan would fail due to uncertainty and lack of confidence and merger/fragmentation would occur quicker. Considering the history of this company and management, I simply cannot and will not give any blind trust to promises and any "yes" vote on a TA will have to give me confidence in job security. I'll vote no without that, the cos
equences be damned.
02-10-2012 | 01:51 PM
#64
I'm a man of my word.
Joined: Jul 2008
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From: Devil's Advocate
I understand all too well the Golden Handcuffs. Some guys get bogged down with a family, a house, cars, etc, etc, to the point where they are unwilling to move on. It's sad really, seeing some guys relegate themselves to the regional world simply because they are "comfortable." I understand the fear though, it's tough to move on and start over, especially in these uncertain times where a furlough could be just around the corner for anyone in the bottom 10-15% (my guesstimate) of a seniority list. Still, the more guys that stay put, the harder it becomes for other guys to move up and move on. It creates a log jam, if you will, which in turn makes things harder on those of us below.
Last edited by CaptainCarl; 02-10-2012 at 02:03 PM.
02-10-2012 | 02:36 PM
#65
Roll’n Thunder
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From: Pilot
02-11-2012 | 09:51 AM
#66
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Joined: Feb 2012
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From: 787
not saying we SHOULD take concessions, just saying that well most likely be offered the chance to get all the replacement aircraft if we give them what they want. The question is how much will they want. If its just a couple dollars difference then its worth it. Much more then that will be bad IMO. I really don't see them cutting FO's that much. Its our senior captains that will get whacked, since the company will be even more happy if the cuts force some of those senior guys to move on.
Wont happen. US airways has 2 class 190's and they have 99 seats with 12, I think, first class. In order to get a 190 down to 88 seats you would have to remove atleast three rows of seats and I don't think AA would want that much first class capacity on a 88 seat jet, it would destroy any possibility of that aircraft making any money.
02-11-2012 | 10:05 AM
#67
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From: Baja Vermont
Mainline pay for mainline equiptment! If you agree to fly these aircraft for regional wages, you're doing serious damage to your own career progression.
CANAM
And what if the judge grants AA request and turns it into regional pay for mainline equipment? Will the APA demand the E190s go to AE? Will AE refuse to fly them?
Just askin'
02-11-2012 | 02:00 PM
#68
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Come on man. Do you really want to take concessions in order to fly a "bigger" airplane? This is what is killing the industry. I know I'm going to be flamed becasue I fly the 170 but I didn't take concessions to do it and in fact if I don't get a raise here soon I will set the brake and walk off. Lets stop the bleeding.
02-11-2012 | 04:13 PM
#69
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From: 1986 LeBaron Convertable
Put it this way, if you create a time machine, go back in time. All the way back to 1990. Find the nearest mainline pilot and tell him/her that very soon regionals will be flying jets. The pilot would laugh. When you told him/her they'd be 76-99 seat jets, he/she would litterally die.
02-11-2012 | 04:17 PM
#70
Banned
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Semantics semanitcs. What if the judge forces AE to fly 777s? What if she makes AE fly for free?! At the end of the day, I'm assuming AE's MEC would have to negotiate a payscale. The AE MEC should walk away, but they never do. This will only further slow the career progression of pilots by making them fly larger planes for less and less money.
Put it this way, if you create a time machine, go back in time. All the way back to 1990. Find the nearest mainline pilot and tell him/her that very soon regionals will be flying jets. The pilot would laugh. When you told him/her they'd be 76-99 seat jets, he/she would litterally die.
Put it this way, if you create a time machine, go back in time. All the way back to 1990. Find the nearest mainline pilot and tell him/her that very soon regionals will be flying jets. The pilot would laugh. When you told him/her they'd be 76-99 seat jets, he/she would litterally die.
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