tom14cat14

I am just curious why Mainline unions do not push management for one list when they buy a regional? This might stop the process of destroying regionals so they can build them back up. I understand Delta management would not want us merged but I would think the Pilot group would not have a problem as long as we were stapled with a short term fence. Is it because most mainline pilots feel like regional pilots are below them? Or is it because they do not want to spend negotiating capital to get management to merge? I only see advantages to one list from a pilot perspective as long as the regional pilots are stapled. By the way I am not really trying to start a flame war, just looking for some thoughts on why no major has said we have to merge any company management buys instead it is only any major airline they buy.

Bucking Bar

Your post makes sense, is the way things once were and the way things should be. In large part the union accepted outsourcing as a way to fix B Scale by moving it off the property. Current union leadership reasoning for fighting unity:

• The pilots of that airline do not meet our standards.
• The type of flying performed by that airline does not appeal to us and would disuade others from working here.
• Management decides who merges. Labor has no voice / is ineffective / would pay too high a price for mergers.
• Outsourcing results in mainline pilots getting paid more. Outsourcing is good.
• Flow through agreements are as good.

... and don't expect much sympathy from Wychor. If I am not mistaken he voted against ASA and Comair when they tried to gain ALPA support for a merge with Delta.

Al Czervik

Never mind.

tom14cat14

Thanks for your input Bar. I was afraid to type it because I figured it would become a huge flame war.

CarolinaAngler

So what do you think happens with pinnacle? What does the end game look like?

FlyJSH

[*]The pilots of that airline do not meet our standards.
We don't (as least those who have been here more than two years). We are all uneducated, checkride- bustin', drunks who are so bad many mainline guys won't allow us to carry their families.

[*]The type of flying performed by that airline does not appeal to us and would disuade others from working here.
Absolutely! Who in their right mind wants to fly more than two legs per week? Not to mention, only widebodies have overhead bins large enough to hold a "real" pilot's hat.

[*]Outsourcing results in mainline pilots getting paid more. Outsourcing is good.
Also true. Just don't let any of those peeons take our jobs.

Fly782

While I agree it should all be one, I don't agree with only one group benefitting from it. Most DCI carriers bust their hump to keep Delta going. Delta owns most DCI airplanes, bring them and the pilots in house. Wishful thinking I know but it would be nice for everyone at DCI to get a piece of the action. O well, keep on truckin everyone.

ShyGuy

Because statistically speaking, a good 50% of regional pilots wouldn't pass a Delta interview (be it HR, tech, psych portion). Ask yourself, why would DALPA sign off on taking all the pilots on a regional list, without vetting them first.

Also, because 9E doesn't have any hiring standards. A pulse and a willingness to show up to class is all that is needed. In some cases, an interview wasn't even necessary, certain colleges had programs where the graduates got class dates without interviews. Delta would like to have a little higher of a standard than that. I'm against flows because it doesn't give an airline a chance to vet through the bad personalities, the guys who make this job harder than it has to be and are just plain annoying to fly with. Ask yourself, you know who these guys are, would you really want them at Delta.

Bucking Bar

Did Delta test the Pan Am Express pilots? How about Northwest pilots?

Did Tigers vet those small jet flying Fed Ex pilots?

Unity before bigotry. Those Pinnacle pilots are already flying Delta pax.

I think the stats were less than about 4 percent of applicants made it through the process from application (over 12, 500 to the number off probation in the last ten years) if you back out internal hires and transfers. That meant precisely nothing in the mergers Delta has done...

ShyGuy

I edited my post above to add more information before you typed this. See post above. Pan Am/NWA/Tigers are an entirely different situation.