rickair7777

Neither alpa nor not-alpa will solve the regional problem. Remember there is only a "regional problem" in the eyes of regional pilots...from the perspective of managers (and a lot of mainline pilots) the regional systems works great!

The only solution is vertical or horizontal unity...

Vertical: Regional pilots on mainline list for the brand they fly. This is up to the mainline pilots, and is possible, though doubtless an uphill battle.

Horizontal: One union actually controlling all regional labor (not happening, even the majors don't have this). The west coast longshoreman are the only good example I can think of.

saab2000

I'm not sure I agree with this assessment entirely. Many passengers recognize it for what it is, especially on the smaller "regional" jets. They know they're cramped and often have less well run operations. The regular customers certainly know this.

And I'm not even sure most mainline pilots like it. I have a bunch of friends who work at mainline carriers. We all do. Most of them don't actually like it but accept it because the system as we now know it has been in place for so long - over 20 years of RJs now. There has been incremental growth and scope decay for a long time and we now accept flights on contact carriers as the norm, rather than the exception.

Where I agree with you is that managers like it. And I suppose at some level shareholders do but even there I'm not so sure.

But I don't think the customers like it and I don't even think our friends who fly larger aircraft like it. They're commuting on someone else's metal and getting bumped and seeing their brand diminished by less reliable carriers.

We'll see what happens over the next few years. Right now the retirements are just starting in large numbers and seem to continue virtually indefinitely. Schools are not producing enough pilots to fill all the seats.

USMCFLYR

What is the difference in the minor leagues and major leagues except for supposed talent/experience level?

Minor league baseball is played with real balls and real bats in front of real fans.

gloopy

Um, what?

Where did you get allowed from, and what, if anything, are you trying to say about Airbus?

I'm talking about primary training and time building in the US. What are you talking about?

rickair7777

The customers only dislike it to the extent that they're cramped and have to gate-check their carry-ons...and the E-175s will fix that eventually (too bad bombardier went off tilting at windmills with the c-series instead of updating their RJ's). Pax are perfectly happy with the low price and high frequency, and nobody but the colgan relatives cares about pilot experience level...many pax assume flying is SUPPOSED to be dangerous, and count themselves lucks to survive any given flight

Of course many individual mainline pilots don't like it, but the reality is that the big unions are NOT falling all over themselves to fix the regional problem because they'd have to tell their constituents to pony up for the cost difference (management won't be giving it away).

saab2000

The difference is measurable in baseball. Stats rule the world of baseball. Minor league baseball is a farm system for major league teams.

There's no measurable difference between pilots of a Boeing or Airbus and the pilot of a contract carrier. They are not held to different standards of job performance. My ATP is the same as the one of the guy/gal just hired at AA or DAL or UAL.

The pilots who are being hired at majors from regionals are not the "Best" pilots. They're usually the prettiest or the best connected (Daddy) or the luckiest.

saab2000

I agree with most of this. But RJ flights aren't cheaper. In many cases they're actually more expensive because they go to monopolized destinations.

Last week we looked up the price of a RT ticket on one of the routes we frequently fly at my carrier from DCA. It was around $1000 for a ticket on that 90 minute flight. It's frequently a full flight.

USMCFLYR

Well...you took that far to seriously.
Carry on.

saab2000

I take it seriously because I've heard people say things like this who actually believe what they're saying.

When I worked overseas some of the stuff I heard said was jaw dropping.

You just never know!

rickair7777

And they'd be even more expensive if the pilots were getting mainline pay. The current regional pay system keeps prices lower than they would be otherwise...even if they're not currently very cheap.