RJET down by -50% today?
07-27-2015 | 03:09 PM
#81
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,154
Likes: 192
I believe you're talking about a guild. The average pilot considers him/herself a conservative due to their past military service / expectation of higher wages and dislike of taxes - so they call their unions "Associations".
We are blue collar hourly workers. While the guys who've made it financially can call themselves conservatives and vote accordingly, pilots by and large vote against their own self interests (e.g. voting for anti-labor candidates).
Flame away, but this is a BIG part of why you and I will never live to see a guild / national seniority list; it's too socialized for most pilots to stomach. Also, read "Flying The Line" 1&2 to read about how we got to where pilots are able to think of themselves as anything but hourly workers dependent upon labor unions to bargain on their behalf.
We are blue collar hourly workers. While the guys who've made it financially can call themselves conservatives and vote accordingly, pilots by and large vote against their own self interests (e.g. voting for anti-labor candidates).
Flame away, but this is a BIG part of why you and I will never live to see a guild / national seniority list; it's too socialized for most pilots to stomach. Also, read "Flying The Line" 1&2 to read about how we got to where pilots are able to think of themselves as anything but hourly workers dependent upon labor unions to bargain on their behalf.
All true. Many books could be written as to how we as a society talk and act, but are then suprised when we take it on the chin, when that is exactly what we had been economically advocating for.
General Wesley Clark stated in his book "Winning Modern Wars"
that "they" (he spent some paragraphs sketching out whom "they" were)
"have successfully aligned the interests of the wealthy with the sympathies of middle America"(rough quote from memory...but close enough)
That statement accurately captures a significant part of the reasons the middle/poor/working class are in the position they(we) are in.
07-27-2015 | 03:28 PM
#82
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 294
Likes: 0
Well, you are a notorious flame-baiter, so your opinion and posts don't hold much water.
I don't personally believe that we will see a "catastrophic collapse" of the regional model like many of you suggest. It will shrink as the big 3 add small narrow body airplanes, but the network carriers will not function without a cheap feed system. They can't compete with the likes of SWA without it. It's too important to the NAS. The majors will preserve their cheap feed. They are obsessed with it. Look at how many regionals are now flying for AA. The whipsaw is the tool to keep labor costs at regionals AND mainline in check.
There will absolutely be relaxation of the 1500 hour rule. They will get it. To think otherwise is foolish.
This is just the beginning. RAH will survive.
I don't personally believe that we will see a "catastrophic collapse" of the regional model like many of you suggest. It will shrink as the big 3 add small narrow body airplanes, but the network carriers will not function without a cheap feed system. They can't compete with the likes of SWA without it. It's too important to the NAS. The majors will preserve their cheap feed. They are obsessed with it. Look at how many regionals are now flying for AA. The whipsaw is the tool to keep labor costs at regionals AND mainline in check.
There will absolutely be relaxation of the 1500 hour rule. They will get it. To think otherwise is foolish.
This is just the beginning. RAH will survive.
With the American regional aviation model broken, consolidation is the answer | CAPA - Centre for Aviation
Republic Airways Holdings Inc - RJET - Stock Quotes
07-27-2015 | 04:02 PM
#83
Banned
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 988
Likes: 0
The Envoy replacement attempt is already failing over at PSA and what about the Envoy replacement at Republic? Doesn't that wreck the whole Envoy replacement is working theory?
07-27-2015 | 04:10 PM
#84
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,809
Likes: 0
From: Left
07-27-2015 | 04:12 PM
#85
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 504
Likes: 0
07-27-2015 | 04:26 PM
#86
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 558
Likes: 0
Well, you are a notorious flame-baiter, so your opinion and posts don't hold much water.
I don't personally believe that we will see a "catastrophic collapse" of the regional model like many of you suggest. It will shrink as the big 3 add small narrow body airplanes, but the network carriers will not function without a cheap feed system. They can't compete with the likes of SWA without it. It's too important to the NAS. The majors will preserve their cheap feed. They are obsessed with it. Look at how many regionals are now flying for AA. The whipsaw is the tool to keep labor costs at regionals AND mainline in check.
There will absolutely be relaxation of the 1500 hour rule. They will get it. To think otherwise is foolish.
This is just the beginning. RAH will survive.
I don't personally believe that we will see a "catastrophic collapse" of the regional model like many of you suggest. It will shrink as the big 3 add small narrow body airplanes, but the network carriers will not function without a cheap feed system. They can't compete with the likes of SWA without it. It's too important to the NAS. The majors will preserve their cheap feed. They are obsessed with it. Look at how many regionals are now flying for AA. The whipsaw is the tool to keep labor costs at regionals AND mainline in check.
There will absolutely be relaxation of the 1500 hour rule. They will get it. To think otherwise is foolish.
This is just the beginning. RAH will survive.
07-27-2015 | 04:58 PM
#88
Roll’n Thunder
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,150
Likes: 562
From: Pilot
07-27-2015 | 05:01 PM
#89
Banned
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 787
Likes: 0
Guys, this is serious. I'm not one to normally predict that an airline will fail or that the "writing is on the wall" or any of that.
But this is legit. Anyone who knows anything about airline history and in particular the specifics of what happened to Pan-Am, Eastern, and Braniff will know that Republic is on borrowed time.
Assests don't mean much in a situation such as this one. Look for much of it to be sold off soon in a desperate attempt to raise some emergency cash. Then that money will vaporize within a quarter and more assests will be sold off. Soon enough Republic will simply close its doors. Just like that.
It happened to Pan Am. They sold of asset after asset throughout the 80s in an effort to rebound....mainly to United. Then came Delta, and all seemed well for about 2 months. Literally, 2 months is all it took for "the world to change" . Those were Delta's exact words.
Then one day Pan Am pilots were in their training center in the Sims like any normal day when the call came. Pack all your stuff and get the hell out. Pan Am is finished. Everybody literally had to jump out a side door into bushes to get out of the building because the front doors were already chained shut when hey got there.
Point is, read up and educate yourselves on airline history and how these things work. It would take a miracle for Republic to pull out of this. A miracle and possibly a merger. And a merger would be nasty. Read up on the precedent set in the 80s regarding "expectations" when it comes to seniority mergers.
I would advise Republic pilots to get out now while you still have a chance to accrue seniority elsewhere. If you are not at Republic, don't go.
But this is legit. Anyone who knows anything about airline history and in particular the specifics of what happened to Pan-Am, Eastern, and Braniff will know that Republic is on borrowed time.
Assests don't mean much in a situation such as this one. Look for much of it to be sold off soon in a desperate attempt to raise some emergency cash. Then that money will vaporize within a quarter and more assests will be sold off. Soon enough Republic will simply close its doors. Just like that.
It happened to Pan Am. They sold of asset after asset throughout the 80s in an effort to rebound....mainly to United. Then came Delta, and all seemed well for about 2 months. Literally, 2 months is all it took for "the world to change" . Those were Delta's exact words.
Then one day Pan Am pilots were in their training center in the Sims like any normal day when the call came. Pack all your stuff and get the hell out. Pan Am is finished. Everybody literally had to jump out a side door into bushes to get out of the building because the front doors were already chained shut when hey got there.
Point is, read up and educate yourselves on airline history and how these things work. It would take a miracle for Republic to pull out of this. A miracle and possibly a merger. And a merger would be nasty. Read up on the precedent set in the 80s regarding "expectations" when it comes to seniority mergers.
I would advise Republic pilots to get out now while you still have a chance to accrue seniority elsewhere. If you are not at Republic, don't go.
07-27-2015 | 05:24 PM
#90
Pilot
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 149
Likes: 0
Guys, this is serious. I'm not one to normally predict that an airline will fail or that the "writing is on the wall" or any of that.
But this is legit. Anyone who knows anything about airline history and in particular the specifics of what happened to Pan-Am, Eastern, and Braniff will know that Republic is on borrowed time.
Assests don't mean much in a situation such as this one. Look for much of it to be sold off soon in a desperate attempt to raise some emergency cash. Then that money will vaporize within a quarter and more assests will be sold off. Soon enough Republic will simply close its doors. Just like that.
It happened to Pan Am. They sold of asset after asset throughout the 80s in an effort to rebound....mainly to United. Then came Delta, and all seemed well for about 2 months. Literally, 2 months is all it took for "the world to change" . Those were Delta's exact words.
Then one day Pan Am pilots were in their training center in the Sims like any normal day when the call came. Pack all your stuff and get the hell out. Pan Am is finished. Everybody literally had to jump out a side door into bushes to get out of the building because the front doors were already chained shut when hey got there.
Point is, read up and educate yourselves on airline history and how these things work. It would take a miracle for Republic to pull out of this. A miracle and possibly a merger. And a merger would be nasty. Read up on the precedent set in the 80s regarding "expectations" when it comes to seniority mergers.
I would advise Republic pilots to get out now while you still have a chance to accrue seniority elsewhere. If you are not at Republic, don't go.
But this is legit. Anyone who knows anything about airline history and in particular the specifics of what happened to Pan-Am, Eastern, and Braniff will know that Republic is on borrowed time.
Assests don't mean much in a situation such as this one. Look for much of it to be sold off soon in a desperate attempt to raise some emergency cash. Then that money will vaporize within a quarter and more assests will be sold off. Soon enough Republic will simply close its doors. Just like that.
It happened to Pan Am. They sold of asset after asset throughout the 80s in an effort to rebound....mainly to United. Then came Delta, and all seemed well for about 2 months. Literally, 2 months is all it took for "the world to change" . Those were Delta's exact words.
Then one day Pan Am pilots were in their training center in the Sims like any normal day when the call came. Pack all your stuff and get the hell out. Pan Am is finished. Everybody literally had to jump out a side door into bushes to get out of the building because the front doors were already chained shut when hey got there.
Point is, read up and educate yourselves on airline history and how these things work. It would take a miracle for Republic to pull out of this. A miracle and possibly a merger. And a merger would be nasty. Read up on the precedent set in the 80s regarding "expectations" when it comes to seniority mergers.
I would advise Republic pilots to get out now while you still have a chance to accrue seniority elsewhere. If you are not at Republic, don't go.
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