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Originally Posted by Arliss
(Post 2277266)
And then trans states, and commutair, benefit by taking planes from xjet, and skywest basically letting xjet/asa downsize into nothing.
All these years only management has taken progressive, across-the-board steps to changing the industry, and in their favor of course. Until the pilots' so-called "union" is actually unified, just expect more of the same: mainline shuffling their airplanes around to the cheapest most junior pilot group, while the senior group is forced to start over at the cheaper airlines, making less money for themselves while making more money for mainline management and flying the exact same passengers they did at their previous airline. Rinse and repeat. We all know what is happening. The question is, what is to be done about it?? |
Originally Posted by sweetholyjesus
(Post 2277286)
I hope you don't blame certain pilot groups for this. Can't do much when mainline owns the airplanes. I believe all 3 carriers you mentioned are ALPA. What is ALPA doing about it? I'll give you one guess...
All these years only management has taken progressive, across-the-board steps to changing the industry, and in their favor of course. Until the pilots' so-called "union" is actually unified, just expect more of the same: mainline shuffling their airplanes around to the cheapest most junior pilot group, while the senior group is forced to start over at the cheaper airlines, making less money for themselves while making more money for mainline management and flying the exact same passengers they did at their previous airline. Rinse and repeat. We all know what is happening. The question is, what is to be done about it?? Mainline ALPA pilot groups are the only ones who can unify their brand. It also doesn't help that there are non-union pilot groups. |
Originally Posted by Nevjets
(Post 2277287)
Mainline ALPA pilot groups are the only ones who can unify their brand. It also doesn't help that there are non-union pilot groups.
Also, I believe the unionized groups vastly outweigh the non-unionized groups. |
Originally Posted by HeWhoRazethAll
(Post 2276990)
Look at Compass. Once the absolute mecca with upgrade times under a year, highest pay (for like a month), crazy growth and guys who could hold lines right out of the school-house; you'd move 10% on the seniority list every month. Now, less than 2 years later, hiring freeze and lost 8% of their fleet. There is NO stability, except for MAYBE Skywest and Horizon. The only thing you should place bets on is attrition, and the house always gets their money on that bet.
CompAss was never the "highest pay". |
What is killing ExpressJet is the seniority system, not SkyWest, not the unions...
If they weren't so senior they wouldn't be stagnant, there would be seniority movement, there would be new hires to keep up with staffing needs. |
Originally Posted by FlexNinja
(Post 2276666)
You are correct to an extent, but do you think it will make a difference now that American is fully merged and one big company? Seems like they are dumping a ton of money into their three wholly owned and cutting the flying from the contract carriers. This, to me, seems like a game changer. American doubling down on regional lift, while Delta shifts away. I dont think that American will every go totally away from contracts, but they are reducing.
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Originally Posted by dl773
(Post 2277318)
What is killing ExpressJet is the seniority system, not SkyWest, not the unions...
If they weren't so senior they wouldn't be stagnant, there would be seniority movement, there would be new hires to keep up with staffing needs. |
Originally Posted by Nevjets
(Post 2277287)
Mainline ALPA pilot groups are the only ones who can unify their brand. It also doesn't help that there are non-union pilot groups.
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Originally Posted by PleaseComplete
(Post 2275954)
The 2200 number and associated aircraft all come from upper management which takes that directly from AA. So. Yea. Bottom line AA likes our efficiency and profitability and will give us the planes if we can continue to staff and operate them in that manner. Where AA gets them from not our concern. FYI though, marketing and sales can make new contracts that don't affect old contracts. I would say this is just my two cents worth, however, this exact question was asked to the big cheese in my Indoc class and that is what was said.
Legacy pilot's have a scope clause. Bottom line, scope can't be violated unless AA wants to pay APA millions of dollars, they've done it in the past when TSA took some of Eagle's planes, it was an expensive mistake for AA and Eagle got the planes back while APA's winning lawsuit cost AA millions. I don't think AA will violate scope just so PSA big cheese can honor his word to a new hire class about growing to 2200 pilots. You got played if you honestly believe PSA can grow to 2200 pilots. With the pilot shortage and all, the big cheese might stretch the truth a bit to keep the fire going. AA is scoped out on RJs period. If an AA feeder grows, it's at the demise of anther. |
Originally Posted by 3EngineTaxi
(Post 2276675)
Sadly, the whipsaw is alive and well. As a group, pilots are their own worst enemy. As long as naive pilots continue to chase temporary "growth" and temporary "quick upgrades," the whipsaw will thrive.
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