18/5/5/5 - Page 39 - Airline Pilot Central Forums

#381

Mooner , 11-23-2022 07:19 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by PilotJ3

I even thought we were not going to get so high of takers in the strike vote. I was very hesitant about thinking that the vote was going to pass. I was impressed and I’m sure the company though the same thing “these guys are all happy with te GS, payback, they are not going to vote to strike”.

I knew it would be 99% 3 years ago. Every strike authorization vote is 98-99%. It of itself says nothing and that is not lost on management.

#382

Jp8burner , 11-23-2022 07:33 AM

Line Holder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawaii50

I wouldn't assume that C16 leadership accurately represents the views of most of the LAX pilots.

Nope, but you could say that about any rep. I think LAX has a much higher voter turnout than say, I dunno, ATL. So I’d bet he’s more representative than just about anyone….just not you.

#383

tennisguru , 11-23-2022 07:34 AM

Roll’n Thunder

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesBond

Question 1.... if said "AIP" is reached and sent out as a TA: Is retro pay calculated back to the amendable date, and are all those that worked under that time frame included, living or dead? If the answer is no, I don't even need another five minutes to vote on the rest.

Retro will be defined however the NC and company agree to it. Whether it’s sufficient to pass memrat will be seen.

#384

Mooner , 11-23-2022 07:35 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesBond

Yes, this will be the majority take here. Don’t make the mistake that this board is reflective of the rank and file. It’s not.

Full retro could happen to 2020, but it would be panned here as not enough. For instance, 2%, 5%, 9%, 5%, 5%. Total compounded 28.7%.

I will predict zero retro for 2020,2021. Then 8% retro to Jan 1 2022. 18% effective Jan 1 2023, then 5% for 2024, 5% 2025. Total compounded 40.5%. Hmm, pretty good relative to the full retro case above don’t you think?

Full retro is weak hill to choose to die on. The concept is meaningless because its definition is fluid and changes from pilot to pilot. Total value is all that matters.

#385

Scooter432 , 11-23-2022 07:37 AM

New Hire

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooner

I agree. On balance, it will be a solid gain for Delta pilots.

I’ll stick with my prediction of a “Christmas surprise” articulated in another thread. I will also stick with my belief we will see 100% retro back to Jan 1 2022, no retro for 2020 and 2021. I expect pay raise effective Jan 1 2023 will handily beat inflation for 2023, sufficient to back fill inflation for both 2021 and 2020. Out-year raises for 2024,25 will marginally exceed the 3 year rolling average inflation rate (currently 4.6%). Result: a 5 year period with a positive real rate increase of approximately 1% annually.

Most here will hate it and call for immediate demolition of the MEC and the airline.

The TA will pass 72-28.

**Disclosure**

Of course I’m a company planted trial balloon pilot. As an insider, I will absolutely confirm that this board accurately represents the opinions of the average pilot and management. It is a critical tool to formulate management’s table position.

1 year retro won’t cut it.. not even close.

#386

Vsop , 11-23-2022 07:52 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooner

I get what you’re saying that the cash might be better without full retro, however we must “die on that hill” because of the precedent we would set for future negotiations.
The company cannot have any incentive to drag their feet on future contracts.
The amount of gains I would need to give up on that is very high (perpetual _% raises comes to mind), and even then I would have to think very hard about a no vote.

edit:
and I do understand that Covid was a big black swan event, and the company will claim hardship. We as a group can’t let that be an excuse for them not negotiating in 2019. Black swans seem to fly by about every “0” year. 2020 Covid, 2010 housing crisis, 2001 911, 1990 Iraq, 1980 deregulation , 1970 oil crisis, …

#387

Bottlen0se , 11-23-2022 07:58 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vsop

I personally want to be made whole for lost wages. Whatever accounting trick they do, I don’t care. Full retro back to 2020 could end up being a small percentage of each years wages. Or, 18% of this years wages. For me personally the 18 percent of 2022s wages would end up being pretty damn high. When I do the inflation math on my lost wages to the official cpi, I’m due 50-60k approx. So call it whatever they want, make us whole. Company is still held liable via their wallet and at the end of the day that’s all that matters. Just my 2 cents. Flame suit on.

#388

JamesBond , 11-23-2022 08:03 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooner

I disagree. Those that retired or died need to be paid for work they did.

#389

StartngOvr , 11-23-2022 08:04 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooner

Hmm, pretty good relative to the full retro case above don’t you think?

Nope…..NFW no.

Rewarding the company in any way for protracted foot dragging is a non starter and unacceptable precedent.

#390

FangsF15 , 11-23-2022 08:12 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooner

Of course I’m a company planted trial balloon pilot.

You do a marvelous impression of one.

You are alone on an island.