It wasn't missed. And mentioning that it might amount to a giveback was a fun way to earned one an "idiot" label.

I have vacation next month, and while I'm happy to see the increase in trip value, I'm also seeing my ability to buy my way out of those trips reduced.

I'm not offering judgement as to whether it's good or bad, I'm just saying we were told our vacation wasn't touched. It was touched. So was our sick leave.

If BC had looked at me and said; "We had to give a little in the vacation and sick leave department to gain the 3.75:1 trip rig", then fine. But identifying the concessionary nature of this aspect of the contract change was fightin' words.

Anyway, I'm happy to have the increased trip rig $$$$, I just wish we hadn't given up some sick leave and vacation time in exchange-we certainly didn't need to.

Anything with TAFB > than 22+30 will pay more (22+30/3.75 = 6CH).

Look at it another way -

You had 7 days or 42 hours of vacation. Old rules a weeklong pairing paid 42 hours, under new rules that same 7 days pays 44.8 hours. So for the same 7 days off it cost you 2.8 hours more.

Guess my sarcasm smiley thingy wasn't enabled to make it more clear that I was just joking around. Better?
Maybe not so much about different P/D rates for Europe and Pacific rim.

Not by my math. As I compare my Oct '07 and Jan '08 bidpacks, I see an identical number of days off at an average of 18.8.

The BLG in Oct was 88:49 and in Jan it's 95:13. I get more money for the same amount of work-good!

The downside is my vacation buying power is reduced by about 7%. Same with my sick leave.

Thinking about vacation...
I guess that it's a good thing the >8 isn't paid until flown or your vacation bank would take a bigger hit (up to 10%) on some trips that you knock out.

Hmmm...The MEM A300 OCT07 bidpack's AVG BLG was 88:35 and JAN08 is only 87:47. But, I get an extra day off next month. And, if I had 15 days of vacation, in either one, I could take the whole month off.

Just curious...How many days of sick leave do you have in your sick bank?

Your mileage may vary. I was speaking for the bidpack for the base in which I am assigned. My reality is about a 7-8% loss in buying power. The loss is there. It's real. It may not be system-wide, but to say it isn't out there would be inaccurate.


About 12 days worth this month. That same bank will only be worth about 11 days next month.

But you see, that's just the problem. If we all just focus on one part of our contract, in one month, in one base...It's not going to work for anyone.

There are many lines, in other domiciles, in other airplanes, that are made with trips that aren't based on TAFB. Everything from "out and backs", "duty rig trips", MPDP trips, to "hard time trips" are all not based on TAFB. So, if I bid a line that is made up of hard time trips...Am I getting ripped off on my vacation, because I can't knock off a 7hr hard time trip with 6 hrs of vacation? No, of course not. It's the same thing.

All good points, and admittedly, I've been looking more at my bidpack than system-wide. But I'm not saying you are getting "ripped off" when you can't knock out a 7-hr hard time trip with 6 hours of vacation. I've merely identified that there has been some loss in what you can knock out on TAFB trips with vacation and sick leave. It isn't big. It's very small.

The insipidness of it concerns me almost as much as the vehement denial that it amounts to a giveback, however small it may be.

.....And I do like the fact that most of my trips are worth more now.

To me, it's probably worth the giveback. Just don't tell me it doesn't exist.