GF,

I never talked down to you WRT corporate flying. I DID argue with you WRT comparisons on QOL. I think you need to realize it isn't ALL of the DPJ flying that's the beef here. It's simply any biz jet that they're operating which is configured to less then 51 seats AND exceeds a MGTOW of 65,000 lbs.

Delta pilots SCOPE clearly states that any aircraft not operated by Delta pilots that is configured to less then 51 seats MAY NOT exceed a MGTOW of 65,000 lbs. It's black and white in our contract, & MUST be enforced regardless of how small. We as airline pilots have already been burned for taking scope casually. If we don't stand up, management will continue to push us around and take advantage of us in every way they can.

This is absurd. Imagine the ****storm when delta pilots now have to prep one of these corporate jets for flight. Sorry, I can't pull pins, engine covers, get coffee/ice/newspapers/catering/clean-up after passengers deplane. It isn't in my contract.

Exactly.

And I agree with DAL pilots standing up for scope.... but in this case those large jets will get their management elsewhere and Delta Private Jets will simply not have those size aircraft on their certificate. In the end they will end up chartering third party lift when they need to. DAL pilots will see no job benefit from this. From a scope standpoint, yes they have drawn a line in the sand and for that I applaud them.

That customer service will put an end to DAE then the problem has gone away.

Can't argue with fighting for scope, and if it's against the contract, it's against the contract.

That said, if there was a way for the Delta pilot group to use this as a bargaining chip for some *real* scope protection, that's how I'd play it. As others have said, there's no way for a charter operation to make any money with airline pilot work rules. Hell, it's hard enough for a 135 operator to make money while treating the pilots like dog ****. And yeah, the customer base is completely different. If you have the means to charter a 65K+ MGTOW aircraft, you're not gonna 'slum it' in the back of some 777. DPJ is absolutely no threat to the Delta pilot group. If it's making money for Delta, all the better.

Tell management you're willing to relax the weight restriction on airplanes with less than 19 seats, and in exchange you want the flying for every aircraft with more.

BiigD

What are your odds on DL trading the RJs for the bizjets? And what are odds that the line pilots at DL wanting to fly the RJs at RJ pay scales?

GF

johnso29

My apologies if I took your comments as derisive of corporate aviation, many others were, in fact, derisive to say it mildly. Admittedly, I may have brought it on and soon the race to flame is on!

QOL is very subjective, I thrive on habits that might kill you, to paraphrase Mark Twain. I did 6 years of corporate (good company, major newspaper), 5 years of airline (EAL, absolutely hated it; 3 on, 3 off meant one was either coming or going), 18 years of AF (great or not so much, depending) and now 7 years of corporate (great to really good). But, I freely admit I've seen and been acquainted with operators that all the tea in China couldn't get me to work for. I don't understand how their pilots come to work, but they swear by their boss.

GF

Schedule is 8/6, some guys do 15/13. You are assigned to a plane, stay on that plane with that crew. They type rate you on whichever plane you are assigned to. There is a training contract, you sign one each year you go to recurrent, each 6 months if you are a CA, after 4 years with CO. no training contract. Starting pay roughly 40K, if you fly more than your target hours for the month you make more per hour over that target. Health Ins. is crazy cheap for a family. $45/day per diem. They get you to your plane and home on DL flights PS, on your days of work. Crews are good, planes are good, flying is varied, passengers are easy to work with. If you interview they are very upfront in telling you about life at DPJ.
Hope that helps.

It shows they are hiring, do they hire into a specific airframe and is it possible to find out what they are hiring into? Do they show preference if you are already typed?

From what I have seen, they hire into a spec. type A/C. So I would think that if you have a type in that type of A/C you would be looked at before others. With many different type of A/C that are being flown, I would think that having a type on any one of those would 'seperate' you from others. They do keep your resume on file even if they are not hiring for that paticular A/C at this time, so submitting a resume doesn't hurt.
Not sure about how to find out what they are hiring into, it was LR60's a few weeks ago, not sure about today. We received a email from HR that asked if we knew anyone with a type rating in Bizjets should submit a resume.