How will you spend your ExTO?
07-11-2020, 02:58 AM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,613
Originally Posted by Lewbronski
That’s not the reason to vote against concessions.
Feom your description, it sounds like you’re pretty new to the industry.
The reason to vote against concessions is because you want to have a career that’s worth coming back to. Contract improvements are incredibly hard-fought. It takes years to obtain incremental improvements. Each time our profession has faced difficult times, we have collectively ended up taking giant steps backwards. Our profession is a shadow of its former self and was only recently beginning to gain some ground.
All of that work over years and years would be undone in the span of some months. History has proven it will take close to a decade to regain some of what was lost. History has also proven that we have yet to get back all that was lost.
Besides, airline management executives have demonstrated in multiple instances that voting for concessions to stave off furloughs doesn’t often actually prevent furloughs.
Feom your description, it sounds like you’re pretty new to the industry.
The reason to vote against concessions is because you want to have a career that’s worth coming back to. Contract improvements are incredibly hard-fought. It takes years to obtain incremental improvements. Each time our profession has faced difficult times, we have collectively ended up taking giant steps backwards. Our profession is a shadow of its former self and was only recently beginning to gain some ground.
All of that work over years and years would be undone in the span of some months. History has proven it will take close to a decade to regain some of what was lost. History has also proven that we have yet to get back all that was lost.
Besides, airline management executives have demonstrated in multiple instances that voting for concessions to stave off furloughs doesn’t often actually prevent furloughs.
07-11-2020, 06:38 AM
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 588
I have “furlough bait” on me too, but I’m in the no concessions corner. I would rather come back to what we have than give it away, still get furloughed, and then have to come back to concessions. Then spend the rest of my career watching us try to negotiate back to where we were. No thanks... no concessions.
07-11-2020, 07:06 AM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: FOD
Posts: 519
I'm putting in for two years and will be back to driving school bus in the fall, assuming they have a school year. I'm looking forward to not commuting for the first time in my career, and will be using the time to fix our current place up while finding a spot to move to in a base.
07-11-2020, 07:41 AM
#54
Gets Weekend Reserve
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,615
Here's a quote from one of our VSP takers I read on SWAPA forums. A class act captain:
The bold italics part really strikes a chord with me because that's precisely how I feel. I am indeed jealous of him, and I'm actively working on reaching that point in my life sooner rather than later. As I said before, I truly hope that this gift is available to me when I reach that stage in my life/career.
Some I have talked to say that full pay IS required till 65.
Some like me have no ex, their kids are self sufficient, lots of equity on homes, spouse who is frugal, little debt, etc.
Some I have talked to mention their exes, young children, bad investments and a LOVE of toys. My toys are 6k $ motorcycles of which I have a few. I haven't had a vehicle payment in 10 years, sold my 58k $ airplane, etc.
My hobbies are cheap but some have expensive ones. My wife is self sufficient.
Choices in the past for some are the biggest reasons for "not being able" decisions of some 55-64 year olds I have talked to.
As I talk to my first officers about leaving most say they are jealous. I point out that if they are in their 20's-40's they too can leave early but need to actively plan for that. I never intended to stay till 65.
Three years ago I planned on leaving at 62. It was going to happen. Now I am leaving at 59.
A few pilots I have talked to say they don't know what they would do if they retired. I feel for them. They WILL be faced with the same issue at 65.
Me? Having to "go to work" gets in my way of doing the things I have planned or somethings I have not even thought of yet. Round the world motorcycle trip, sailing across great oceans (not by myself lol), etc.
My wife is my biggest supporter in leaving. She doesn't "need" me around all the time. She "wants me" but does not demand me. She likes to laugh at my jokes even if they are on the phone from thousands of miles away.
For me, flying here has just been a blast but just a "stage" in my life. It does not define me. I do not fear the uncertain future. That's not totally true though. I am nervous but I ask myself how I will feel on the 1st of September and know I will wake up and ask "What do I need to do today to get ready to go and where am I going?"
I will be "somewhere" on a February day and be glad I am not studying for a check ride. I will not miss laying in a hotel waiting 7 more hours to lobby. I WILL miss most of my fellow employees.
Some like me have no ex, their kids are self sufficient, lots of equity on homes, spouse who is frugal, little debt, etc.
Some I have talked to mention their exes, young children, bad investments and a LOVE of toys. My toys are 6k $ motorcycles of which I have a few. I haven't had a vehicle payment in 10 years, sold my 58k $ airplane, etc.
My hobbies are cheap but some have expensive ones. My wife is self sufficient.
Choices in the past for some are the biggest reasons for "not being able" decisions of some 55-64 year olds I have talked to.
As I talk to my first officers about leaving most say they are jealous. I point out that if they are in their 20's-40's they too can leave early but need to actively plan for that. I never intended to stay till 65.
Three years ago I planned on leaving at 62. It was going to happen. Now I am leaving at 59.
A few pilots I have talked to say they don't know what they would do if they retired. I feel for them. They WILL be faced with the same issue at 65.
Me? Having to "go to work" gets in my way of doing the things I have planned or somethings I have not even thought of yet. Round the world motorcycle trip, sailing across great oceans (not by myself lol), etc.
My wife is my biggest supporter in leaving. She doesn't "need" me around all the time. She "wants me" but does not demand me. She likes to laugh at my jokes even if they are on the phone from thousands of miles away.
For me, flying here has just been a blast but just a "stage" in my life. It does not define me. I do not fear the uncertain future. That's not totally true though. I am nervous but I ask myself how I will feel on the 1st of September and know I will wake up and ask "What do I need to do today to get ready to go and where am I going?"
I will be "somewhere" on a February day and be glad I am not studying for a check ride. I will not miss laying in a hotel waiting 7 more hours to lobby. I WILL miss most of my fellow employees.
The bold italics part really strikes a chord with me because that's precisely how I feel. I am indeed jealous of him, and I'm actively working on reaching that point in my life sooner rather than later. As I said before, I truly hope that this gift is available to me when I reach that stage in my life/career.
07-11-2020, 03:41 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2016
Posts: 104
Originally Posted by WHACKMASTER
Yup. It’s pretty obvious that they’re not seeing enough VSP/ExTO applicants as they need to meet the suppressed demand. It doesn’t take a genius to read between the lines.
That said, I’m taking an ExTO and for those that qualify for VSP, I think you’re absolutely crazy if you don’t take it. It’s not like you’re gonna be able to crush 150 TFP/month going forward. With all due respect, everyone’s situation is different but 192K a year to go away? Why can’t I be older?!
That said, I’m taking an ExTO and for those that qualify for VSP, I think you’re absolutely crazy if you don’t take it. It’s not like you’re gonna be able to crush 150 TFP/month going forward. With all due respect, everyone’s situation is different but 192K a year to go away? Why can’t I be older?!
07-11-2020, 04:42 PM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,030
If you’re 60;
67 trips x 60 months = 4020 total trips.
4020/100=40.2 months at 100 trips/mo.
If you work five years from 60-65, you’ve worked for free for 3.35 years (60-63) to earn 100tfp/mo for the last 1.65 years of your career.
If you’re 62;
67tfp x 36 months = 2412 total trips.
You work for free From 62-64 to make 100 tfp/month your last year.
67 trips x 60 months = 4020 total trips.
4020/100=40.2 months at 100 trips/mo.
If you work five years from 60-65, you’ve worked for free for 3.35 years (60-63) to earn 100tfp/mo for the last 1.65 years of your career.
If you’re 62;
67tfp x 36 months = 2412 total trips.
You work for free From 62-64 to make 100 tfp/month your last year.
07-11-2020, 04:52 PM
#57
Furloughed Again?!
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Boeing 737
Posts: 4,796
Originally Posted by Grumpyaviator
If you’re 60;
67 trips x 60 months = 4020 total trips.
4020/100=40.2 months at 100 trips/mo.
If you work five years from 60-65, you’ve worked for free for 3.35 years (60-63) to earn 100tfp/mo for the last 1.65 years of your career.
If you’re 62;
67tfp x 36 months = 2412 total trips.
You work for free From 62-64 to make 100 tfp/month your last year.
67 trips x 60 months = 4020 total trips.
4020/100=40.2 months at 100 trips/mo.
If you work five years from 60-65, you’ve worked for free for 3.35 years (60-63) to earn 100tfp/mo for the last 1.65 years of your career.
If you’re 62;
67tfp x 36 months = 2412 total trips.
You work for free From 62-64 to make 100 tfp/month your last year.
I would like you to post that on the swapa forum. But first you should change your name and go into witness protection...
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07-11-2020, 07:35 PM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,030
Originally Posted by ZapBrannigan
I would like you to post that on the swapa forum. But first you should change your name and go into witness protection...
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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