YES a legacy contract would pass...

Bob, if you, or anyone that reports to you is reading this, please fall of your chair or choke.

Our hourly rates are so insultingly low, that it would take a min of 80% raises to match legacies. The company is banking on precedence.
They will argue that 80-100% raises have no precedence, or do they?
We need to focus on compensation packages.
Increased duty day/calendar day/trip rigs, night override, min days off, retirement, insurance, 401K matching, profit sharing, stock options, you name it.

SCOPE is paramount, however hard to implement.


The ability to add/drop unrestricted, is of the highest priority for QOL.
I personally would NOT give that up, even for legacy rates.

Management's strategy is short term.
None of these fine folks are here for the long term, certainly NOT Mr. Bob.
This is a quick sell or merger job for him and a ride into the sunset.

 

I don't know, Franke is still around and he started his career leasing land to the native Americans before Columbus got here.

 

No no no no no PBS! Disclaimer: I am stubborn, type A, republican pilot. Would everyone vote yes on Delta contract with PBS? Yes. Would you rather have Delta minus a little bit of pay without PBS? YES!! Pay is not everything. The one thing you can NEVER get with PBS even with the best language a pilot can imagine is guaranteed specific dates off, unless you are top seniority. Should we have an open mind with industry standard pay and PBS? Sure but for me, the pay would have to be WAY up. Folks you give up PBS and it is NEVER coming back to lines. Even with vacation being applied after the PBS constructions, min of 4 days of between pairings, and red/green days you will not be able to secure multiple specific days off that you want. Junior pilots will sometimes get the days off you want because of transition and "Global Feasibility" AKA you are screwed because of the system. If the NC has to give transition up for major pay increases I hope it does so without PBS!

 

Look man I hate to break it to you, but PBS is coming. The NC was buttering us up yesterday for it. I hate to say it but the industry standard is PBS. All of our peers minus Southwest have it. You can kick and scream all you want but the NC said it crystal clear yesterday, there whole focus is industry standard pay, retirement, profit sharing, and all those things are going to come at a price. To think we can get within a few dollars of Delta pay rates and keep all our work rules is crazy. That would be about as crazy at the company wanting us to take a pay cut on the next contract. Hate away but negotiations are about give and take.

 

Yes Delta pay minus a little without PBS is crazy but it is a good start. How about industry standard minus a little for no PBS? I think there is a way to give and take without PBS. A lot of us came here because of line bidding. I felt they were buttering it up too but I think they underestimate the hatred for PBS here in this pilot group.

 

PBS is industry standard. Hate to say it, but it's coming.

 

Southwest does not have it. If we give into pbs our lives and the airline changes. We Do not have to go with this!!! If pbs meant so much to the company they would have asked it of the f/a's. They want transition which is not industry standard. Stay tough on PBS and our qol will remain great. It's the reason most of us came here. There is no reason why we can't have both. Line bidding and great pay!!!

 

Perhaps. But one could argue that all the recent contracts that contain PBS already had it in place. Southwest didn't have PBS going into contact talks and they still don't. I'd say "industry standard" is maintaining the status quo.

 

How much will PBS save the company?
Is it only going to be used for line building, how much else will be bundled into it?
Management is trying to package PBS with pay rates.
Pay increases are warranted regardless of PBS.

I agree that it would be better to take a SLIGHTLY lower increase to avoid PBS.

Ideally:
PBS savings+savings from reduced hiring= increase in pay difference

 

PBS at the legacies is a bankruptcy concession. JetBlue and Virgin America have PBS because they were relatively recent startups with no union at founding. PBS was imposed by their management with no recourse. We, at NK, are in neither position. If they want PBS here, management will have to pay dearly.