Originally Posted by Tornado875

I'm pretty terrified that you are the only person in this thread displeased with the fact that you all are underpaid and everyone else is dumping on you for having the audacity to being upset by it. It scares me that the "company can't afford more" mindset I am seeing here might be voting with me in a JCBA.
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Originally Posted by Tornado875

I would just love to see you all get mad instead of carrying water for the company. It's like someone else said, I don't set market rate for pilots, the market does. If fuel goes up in price the company doesn't get to get it at a discount just because they can't figure out how to turn a profit. Market rate is market rate.
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Originally Posted by SSlow

There's no point in getting all angry and riled up, and I voted no the last time around. We are currently not in negotiations with the company and I doubt we ever will be in the future, at least in good faith. NK is a sinking ship and will not be around in another 4-5 years tops. A merger is the only way forward, be it with B6 or whoever can get it done.

But a merger of some sort will happen and there will most likely never be another TA vote with NK.

Originally Posted by RemoveB4flght

Profitability doesn't determine pilot compensation. We aren't asking for a bonus. It's a cost of doing business, not a favor or reward. In any business payroll is (sometimes the only) expense that management has the most direct control over, which is why they push back so hard in negotiations.

We don't get merit based raises in this industry, but we have the same expectations to operate an aircraft in a safe, legal, and efficient manner as any other airline. We are expected to maintain our pilot license through training and checking, and our medical license. There is also not an oversupply of experienced and qualified pilots on the market.

It's funny to me that the same guys who will say we cannot expect much more from Spirit because we "aren't profitable" will in the same breath say the JCBA will be different after B6 takes on billions of dollars in debt to buy us, plus the costs of converting the fleets and training the employees, reworking the network, billions more in order book, widebodies, etc. Management gets paid seven figure salaries to strategize how to do all that, pay the bills/loans, grow the company and make profits all while the costs of business change constantly in an ever evolving market/economy.

While the "burn it down" and "grow some balls" tropes seem polarizing and acting against our own self interests, management will happily utilize the reduced costs of sub-industry pay to even out their balance sheets and quickly forget about returning the favor once back in the black.

Originally Posted by Tornado875

I would just love to see you all get mad instead of carrying water for the company. It's like someone else said, I don't set market rate for pilots, the market does. If fuel goes up in price the company doesn't get to get it at a discount just because they can't figure out how to turn a profit. Market rate is market rate.

Well I hope you're right about the JCBA because I am concerned. And I am sorry if I was off base about Avelo, I thought they topped out right around 300k anymore just a few bucks give or take below y'all. Sorry if I was mistaken, tbh I don't know much about Avelo.

Originally Posted by SoFloFlyer

the pay rates have already been secured by the your union.

Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation

Pay rates have NOT been secured; they've matched the current market rate. You need to keep in mind the JCBA we will be negotiating will most likely BEGIN at current legacy DOS +1 or +2. So our DOS needs to exceed their DOS +1 or +2. If you plan to copy and paste their current rates you're leaving money on the table and setting our pilot group behind.

Originally Posted by SoFloFlyer

You are right. What I’m alluding to is that we won’t be negotiating from our pay rates, but JB pay rates which is the average of the legacy pay rates. A few dollar difference wouldn’t be considered “lacking” in the context of industry average. We should be matching legacy rates in the JCBA, no question about it. I’m confident we’ll get it considering everything that JB’s union has done recently.

Originally Posted by Noisecanceller

”industry average”. “Matching”. NO!!!

INDUSTRY LEADING
EXCEEDING.

Get your mind right

Originally Posted by SoFloFlyer

I’m not advocating for average, but it’s more of a prediction. Though I pray to God it’s industry leading and by more than a few dollars 😩