TA Passes
01-04-2016 | 04:52 AM
#131
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,282
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From: A320 Cap
Paragraph two meet paragraph one. Your carrot described regarding NSNB order perfectly describes why LOA25 should not have been involved in the discussions topics PROPOSED BY THE COMPANY. All I hear is "how could you vote against our once furloughed pilots" and "do you realize how much I stand to lose if this TA is rejected?" Yep, carrot meet stick.
LOA25 is a rounding error for this multi-billion dollar corporation but they are most definitely using it to ram this extension through.
LOA25 is a rounding error for this multi-billion dollar corporation but they are most definitely using it to ram this extension through.
Personally I don't think that anything this nefarious is going on. LOA 25 has been a huge issue since it was implemented so I wasn't at all surprised to see a fix for it included in the first negotiations post C2012
01-04-2016 | 05:07 AM
#132
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,042
Likes: 47
From: 767/757 CA
With that reasoning I'm not sure how you could ever fix LOA 25 then. Let's say this TA flames out and we go into Section 6 negotiations. After a couple of years we come to a TA that includes a fix to LOA 25. One could make the same claim, suggesting that LOA 25 fixing was included to pressure the pilot group to vote the agreement in. So how would you ever make those pilots whole?
Personally I don't think that anything this nefarious is going on. LOA 25 has been a huge issue since it was implemented so I wasn't at all surprised to see a fix for it included in the first negotiations post C2012
Personally I don't think that anything this nefarious is going on. LOA 25 has been a huge issue since it was implemented so I wasn't at all surprised to see a fix for it included in the first negotiations post C2012
You'll constantly hear "Next time we will get it fixed"… over and over. I personally think this TA will be the last opportunity at fixing LOA25… after this opportunity passes we will all be close to 12 year pay (even with LOA25 change to our longevity date) and it won't mean anything.
01-04-2016 | 06:25 AM
#133
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Joined: Mar 2015
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It's plan and simple that LOA25 should have been handled outside this TA. One of two things should have happened:
One : JayH should have demanded LOA25 be withdrawn and those affected by LOA25 made whole before we consider discussing the TA.
Two : Munoz should have voluntarily withdrawn LOA25 as an olive branch of good faith demonstrating a change of relationship with the employees.
There was no logical reason for LOA25 other than gamesmanship on the part of Jeff and JayP.
One : JayH should have demanded LOA25 be withdrawn and those affected by LOA25 made whole before we consider discussing the TA.
Two : Munoz should have voluntarily withdrawn LOA25 as an olive branch of good faith demonstrating a change of relationship with the employees.
There was no logical reason for LOA25 other than gamesmanship on the part of Jeff and JayP.
01-04-2016 | 07:11 AM
#134
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,071
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With that reasoning I'm not sure how you could ever fix LOA 25 then. Let's say this TA flames out and we go into Section 6 negotiations. After a couple of years we come to a TA that includes a fix to LOA 25. One could make the same claim, suggesting that LOA 25 fixing was included to pressure the pilot group to vote the agreement in. So how would you ever make those pilots whole?
Personally I don't think that anything this nefarious is going on. LOA 25 has been a huge issue since it was implemented so I wasn't at all surprised to see a fix for it included in the first negotiations post C2012
Personally I don't think that anything this nefarious is going on. LOA 25 has been a huge issue since it was implemented so I wasn't at all surprised to see a fix for it included in the first negotiations post C2012
Yes LOA25 implemented under the nose of which MEC Chairman? Like AllenAlert said, this could easily be fixed outside of this TA. We've got a couple grievances the company wants tossed. When was the last time a grievance was settled for nearly $39 million?
Hmm.....
01-04-2016 | 07:13 AM
#135
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,071
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You hit the nail on the head. Many pilots not impacted by the effects of LOA25 will continue to kick a remedy down the road using the idea "that its a carrot" and cheats the ENTIRE pilot group… when actually we were sold out last contract which caused LOA25 to be created.
You'll constantly hear "Next time we will get it fixed"… over and over. I personally think this TA will be the last opportunity at fixing LOA25… after this opportunity passes we will all be close to 12 year pay (even with LOA25 change to our longevity date) and it won't mean anything.
You'll constantly hear "Next time we will get it fixed"… over and over. I personally think this TA will be the last opportunity at fixing LOA25… after this opportunity passes we will all be close to 12 year pay (even with LOA25 change to our longevity date) and it won't mean anything.
01-04-2016 | 07:13 AM
#136
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,042
Likes: 47
From: 767/757 CA
Section 6 would be an attempt to fix everything rather pieces of a couple sections. LOA 25 for $39 million is cheap money for company if they get a two year extension on this cheap JCBA.
Yes LOA25 implemented under the nose of which MEC Chairman? Like AllenAlert said, this could easily be fixed outside of this TA. We've got a couple grievances the company wants tossed. When was the last time a grievance was settled for nearly $39 million?
Hmm.....
Yes LOA25 implemented under the nose of which MEC Chairman? Like AllenAlert said, this could easily be fixed outside of this TA. We've got a couple grievances the company wants tossed. When was the last time a grievance was settled for nearly $39 million?
Hmm.....
01-04-2016 | 07:23 AM
#137
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,071
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If it were so easy then why hasn't it been done yet? My thought is that its so low on the totem pole of needs/wants that it won't see the light of day on the next contract (if this fails). The only reason LOA25 is on the table now is the company offered it up… we didn't ask for it.
Why hasn't it been done yet? That would be a question suited for Jay H but I think that totem pole was covered over pizza in Houston.
Most United pilots have a long memory. This POS loa will be corrected.
01-04-2016 | 07:42 AM
#138
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Joined: Apr 2006
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From: 737 CA
Correct, the company has held it in their hip pocket and is playing it masterfully. From the looks I get in the cockpit, it's working like they held a straight flush.
Why hasn't it been done yet? That would be a question suited for Jay H but I think that totem pole was covered over pizza in Houston.
Most United pilots have a long memory. This POS loa will be corrected.
Why hasn't it been done yet? That would be a question suited for Jay H but I think that totem pole was covered over pizza in Houston.
Most United pilots have a long memory. This POS loa will be corrected.
Yes. It will be corrected. Next month! The voting opens tomorrow. I am gonna log in with a big o' wheel barrel, vote yes and fill it full of cash. Squirrel away some serious nuts to prepare for what's coming, and make the furloughees whole. Two birds. One stone... A bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush.
Voting YES. Tomorrow.
01-04-2016 | 07:47 AM
#139
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,042
Likes: 47
From: 767/757 CA
Yes. It will be corrected. Next month! The voting opens tomorrow. I am gonna log in with a big o' wheel barrel, vote yes and fill it full of cash. Squirrel away some serious nuts to prepare for what's coming, and make the furloughees whole. Two birds. One stone... A bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush. Voting YES. Tomorrow.
Voting YES. Tomorrow.
01-04-2016 | 07:59 AM
#140
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,071
Likes: 0
Yes. It will be corrected. Next month! The voting opens tomorrow. I am gonna log in with a big o' wheel barrel, vote yes and fill it full of cash. Squirrel away some serious nuts to prepare for what's coming, and make the furloughees whole. Two birds. One stone... A bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush. Voting YES. Tomorrow.
Voting YES. Tomorrow.So Donald J Nostradamus, do I need to start prepping?
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