I would guess the game plan is not to compete with the Majors on compensation and work rules. The goal will be to position allegiant somewhere between the regional level and that of the majors. They don't want to keep all pilots and recruit the best talent. They want enough to get by at the minimal cost with current market conditions. As they see it, work rules and staffing levels of major airlines are wasteful and inefficient and will cut too deeply into their profit margins. They will strategize this to get just enough of the pilots to agree to just enough to get the job done. It is their belief that the unique nature of "being home every night" will attract enough, given minimal enhancements, to retain and recruit the numbers needed for expansion. Those looking for industry-leading compensation and work rules will probably be disappointed. JMO

What is truly disappointing, is that it was not the actions of organized labor that brought this enlightenment to the minions of management. It was market forces. This is by no means any fault of the union, but much more so the constraints of the Railway labor act that allowed management to drag this on for years. As seen in the letter to shareholders, management knew the timeframe that was traditional for a first contract and had every intention of going the distance before signing anything. They used their influence to deter and delay the contract at every turn through the court system, the mediation Board, the FAA, etc.

If it were not for supply and demand problems, this could go on for years

 

Allegiant will not be competitive on pay or work rules with any of the majors. Even the most senior pilot at Allegiant will be making more money at a major by year 3 and with much better work rules. If it were me, I wouldn't be waiting around for a new contract; that's probably another year plus down the road.

Get out. As soon as possible.

As far as no one applying, that's not going to happen. Allegiant is better than many regionals. There will always be applicants. Allegiant will simply adjust minimum qualifications as the pool of applicants gets a bit smaller.

Good luck to everyone currently at Allegiant.

 

All true. With a history of quick upgrades, a robust business plan (barring a mishap or buyout), and out/back schedules, there will always be a supply of pilots. Management knows that. It all comes down to return on training investment (time) and the ability to staff the flight decks without overwhelming the training pipeline.

Thanks for the well wishes.

 

Problem is right mow "Get Out" is easier said than done. If you're making 6 figures + @ Allegiant then you're really only talking AA/US/DL maybe WN & FedEx - you're odds are pretty long right now landing a slot at one of those carriers. You'll be waiting around for a contract whether want to stay or not.

 

Well, I think you may have it a bit bass ackwards in your assumptions / statements / predictions. It's easy to overlook or forget that when talking about careers (Legacy Airlines, Left Seat, Right Seat, Commuting, Reserve, Line Flying, etc) that one size does not fit all. No kids, single, 27 years old vs. upper 40's & 50's with family and possible multiple airline hats in their closet are just two ends of the vast decision making spectrum.

I think the senior guys & gals at Allegiant are looking at their careers very closely. They will make their decisions based on their own circumstances. I think you are missing a lot of big ticket items when you state "Get out." A new contract will be inked and we won't know the details until that time.

As for your take on the new hires arriving at G4, I would suggest that the attrition is coming from the lower end of the seniority list. Almost every new pilot I fly with is talking about getting time & moving on or how several of their new hire classmates have already left for the big boys. I think the company is seeing this mass exodus from the new pilots and getting worried. Of course a few quite senior Captains have left too but nothing like the bottom of the list.

Not trying to rip your post just jumping in here with some observations.

 

My response was to Labatts', 'the vast majority of us pilots are waiting to see the contract before we decide to stay or leave'. I didn't read any public positive statements about mid-May negotiations and it doesn't sound like things are improving there.

As far as new hires, there's a near endless supply of pilots with SJS. Some will leave quickly for greener pastures but based on what I've seen in similar past operations, management isn't concerned about attrition.

I wrote a more lengthy post but I don't have a dog in this fight so I deleted it and I'll disengage from the conversation. You guys have enough on your hands. Good luck to everyone at Allegiant.

 

Management is concerned about attrition, they are merely unwilling to do what is necessary to stem the tide. They are like the idiots in Detroit in the 70's, they just assume their process will keep working. Random sampling from the bros figures when the stock price finally hits the 100-120 region, the board will really start to flip and force a settlement. Unfortunately, they will be looking in the wrong direction, a pilot contract isn't going to fix the constant bombardment from the press over maintenance issues. For instance, a recent story, abort for a wheel not turning light on the 80, one of the brakes is obviously indicating much hotter than the rest, the CA returns and writes it up...MX thinks they should MEL the indicating system, not fix the brake. The system is obviously working correctly, but they'll just defer it. Have heard them do the same with the windshear system.

It's a systemic failure, safety is only important if it doesn't cost money or delay a flight.

 

I'm well aware of G4's maintenance issues. It doesn't surprise me and neither does the low pilot pay and work rule abuse. All of that is in Maurice Gallagher's DNA - he's been a founder of both WestAir and ValuJet. He's seen this cycle in the airline industry before and successfully kept airlines flying in spite of losing a lot of pilots and having the FAA breathing down his neck on maintenance issues.

The unfortunate reality is that it's cheaper to train a bunch of new pilots than it is to give you guys a decent pay raise and honor work rules. If that weren't the case, management would fix the problems that are causing high attrition rates.

Have you read the Bios of G4's BoD? It looks like it's stacked with friends of Gallagher. Corporate Governance - Board of Directors | Investor Relations | Allegiant Air

 

Are you implying G4 would dance with F9 or that a future F9 merger may be used by G4 to keep the negotiating stalled?

 

MG has been so vehemently opposed to the collective bargaining process that I'm sure he would be willing to entertain anything to avoid giving us a contract.

For those of you hold-outs that are saying this contract needs to be In line with the high end of our industry, I wouldn't hold your breath. Both the company and the union negotiators have said explained that we aren't going to have legacy pay rates. If you plan on staying, adjust your expectations. If you want legacy pay rates and a contract, leave! But that means you need to start filling out apps and going to job fairs. For all of the naysayers on here who say that finding a job is easier said than done, they're correct. You're not going to get called as soon as you hit the submit button on the app. It's going to be a lot of work. But if that work means that by the second year of your new job, you'll be making more than a topped-out Allegiant FO, and your third year you'll be making nearly as much as a captain, then it's completely worth the effort.

Something to consider: in addition to the 16% contribution to your 401k (even without your match), AA is also talking about profit sharing of an additional 5%. 21% vs our 4%. But hey, at least we are home every night.

For those of you who are not considering leaving, ask yourself "If (fill in the blank) called tomorrow and offered me a job, would I take the job?". If the answer is "yes", get your stuff out there. If the answer is "no", you should look up Stockholm Syndrome or battered-wife syndrome.