Should you leave AA?
03-17-2017 | 01:16 PM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2006
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The pay "rates" at AA will probably get better in the next contract but once QOL items are gone from the contract, they pretty much never come back from what I have seen. AA schedules and days off have been trending downward and will likely never get better again.
DAL, SWA and UAL destroy AA in QOL and day off averages for the vast majority of narrow body pilots. Which is worth far more than just pay rates in my book. Personally I would rather have an extra week off every month than get another few dollars an hour. My life at home is worth more than just an extra 15K a year at that level of compensation anyway. Who cares what the rates are if you only get 12-13 days off a month vs their 15-18 days off for junior pilots. (With more pay for the time you are at work to boot).
Unfortunately most people working for AAG seem to only see or care about the dollar amount of pay rates with little regard for work rules or QOL issues. So the fight will probably never be in the right place to "really" improve things.
DAL, SWA and UAL destroy AA in QOL and day off averages for the vast majority of narrow body pilots. Which is worth far more than just pay rates in my book. Personally I would rather have an extra week off every month than get another few dollars an hour. My life at home is worth more than just an extra 15K a year at that level of compensation anyway. Who cares what the rates are if you only get 12-13 days off a month vs their 15-18 days off for junior pilots. (With more pay for the time you are at work to boot).
Unfortunately most people working for AAG seem to only see or care about the dollar amount of pay rates with little regard for work rules or QOL issues. So the fight will probably never be in the right place to "really" improve things.
Also remember that DL, and UA emerged from BK with crappy work rules that they were able to fix in subsequent contracts. We will be no different.
03-17-2017 | 02:35 PM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2016
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From: 6th place
I disagree... I believe the work rules and QOL will come up to match the others with our next contract. Don't forget this is our first post-BK contract where those areas took a hit. And five years under this contract has really educated our pilot group where the changes need to be made. You can bet QOL and work rules are tops on the NC priorities.
Also remember that DL, and UA emerged from BK with crappy work rules that they were able to fix in subsequent contracts. We will be no different.
Also remember that DL, and UA emerged from BK with crappy work rules that they were able to fix in subsequent contracts. We will be no different.
I agree we can fix the work rules, but I think it will take us voting down the first TA. I'm sure the company will come out with shiny pay rates and minimal work rule fixes. Hopefully the BOD doesn't send something subpar out for vote.
it operates almost every day in April
03-17-2017 | 05:44 PM
#74
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: May 2014
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I've been Brown 2.5 years and don't remotely hate the place. I also don't commute, which certainly reduces the pain of juniority that plagues every airline.
Every pilot group deals with variations of the same BS. Stagnation and furloughs and drug-out contract negotiations certainly can lead people to feeling bitter, and with good reason - thankfully now neither AA or UPS is dealing with that.
It ain't all sunshine and rainbows in SDF, and the job ain't for everybody...but it also isn't exactly the indentured servitude some on here would lead others to believe. The compensation & benefits are excellent (thanks IPA!) and worthy of a look by anyone - but if you're 85% or higher at AA with the retirements looming you have, that seems like a sizable risk.
JMHO
Every pilot group deals with variations of the same BS. Stagnation and furloughs and drug-out contract negotiations certainly can lead people to feeling bitter, and with good reason - thankfully now neither AA or UPS is dealing with that.
It ain't all sunshine and rainbows in SDF, and the job ain't for everybody...but it also isn't exactly the indentured servitude some on here would lead others to believe. The compensation & benefits are excellent (thanks IPA!) and worthy of a look by anyone - but if you're 85% or higher at AA with the retirements looming you have, that seems like a sizable risk.
JMHO
Not trying to be insulting or anything.
I've just known a few-and generally they seemed unhappy.
The pay is good, the schedules and mgmt are hard to deal with-so I hear.
03-17-2017 | 05:53 PM
#75
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2006
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03-17-2017 | 08:32 PM
#76
Line Holder
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 394
Likes: 19
I personally know two guys who left FedEx and UPS to come back here after being furloughed. They both hated the schedules there and claimed that the extra $$$ absolutely was not worth what the schedules were doing to their health. So no, people don't need their "head examined".... different courses for different horses. It's a beautiful thing.
That said, if you only have a couple years here and FedEx or UPS calls and they are a better fit, of course it makes sense to leave.
That said, if you only have a couple years here and FedEx or UPS calls and they are a better fit, of course it makes sense to leave.
03-18-2017 | 09:47 AM
#78
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 4,153
Likes: 341
Nobody bids for them you get forced into them.
At least on reserve it used to be you'd do one every week and that was it.
Junior guys have remained junior due to the furlough from the top and no movement and at least on the US side guys hired in 2014 and later have been doing red eyes the whole time
At least on reserve now I've gotten some normal trips every now and then. When I was doing red eyes before the integration when PHL had so many of them I used to tell myself 'this isn't that bad'. Now that I've got a small break from them yes, yes they are.
At least on reserve it used to be you'd do one every week and that was it.
Junior guys have remained junior due to the furlough from the top and no movement and at least on the US side guys hired in 2014 and later have been doing red eyes the whole time
At least on reserve now I've gotten some normal trips every now and then. When I was doing red eyes before the integration when PHL had so many of them I used to tell myself 'this isn't that bad'. Now that I've got a small break from them yes, yes they are.
03-18-2017 | 10:34 AM
#79
On Reserve
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Nope... as a spring of 14 hire I've basically stayed stagnant or actually moved slightly backward in base. I choose to live in base and sit Reserve cuz at least I only do 3-4 a month vs. that "great" line which awarded me 7 redeyes + a 2 day for a whopping 78 hours, thanks to no min calendar day!
03-18-2017 | 10:55 AM
#80
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,826
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From: 6th place
Nope... as a spring of 14 hire I've basically stayed stagnant or actually moved slightly backward in base. I choose to live in base and sit Reserve cuz at least I only do 3-4 a month vs. that "great" line which awarded me 7 redeyes + a 2 day for a whopping 78 hours, thanks to no min calendar day!
You could always be a 190 captain. No redeyes
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