same thing happened at FedEx with almost the exact same title / first guy to fill that roll was also a former Chief Pilot and a former negotiator.

Yeah, you “newbies” know so much more and experienced so much more than us “old guys”. You are going to find out very soon just how “smart” you are. You’re seniority means nothing to APA or ALPA. The next merger you’re going to find out just how much you’re really worth. The “ASSociations” are worthless without principles and management knows it. There is your problem. Just keep talking trash….cause you’re just ****ed you’re not going to get 20 years.

The one thing that worries me as a NH and going to AA from PDT…

(for those who don’t know PDT has some of the worst QoL in the industry, about 10 14 day of lines a month that’s it and that’s the max days off without vacation and the average is 11 days off a month for anyone there less than 5 years) rambled a bit…

… is 50-60% of new hires are coming from flows from wholly owneds which have subpar regional QoL which regional QoL is already subpar… so most of us are getting the biggest QoL jump in our careers and will probably be extremely happy with whatever AA currently has (maybe that’s part of the flow strategy) I know I will be that’s why I tried so hard to get hired outside the flow among all the other reasons.

Another about 35-40% are coming from the military who I’m sure have been moved around the country/world, on deployments away from family for months at a time so I’m sure they will be happy with set schedules knowing when they’re off not too worried about being reassigned mid trip. I can’t really say too much from the military perspective but from the outside looking in the QoL at AA seems better than a typical military QoL. Plus most military hires this is also their first part 121 gig.

Lastly the 10% of us off the street. A lot of us are still coming from said subpar wholly owned’s. Some from other regionals.

It just seems that the majority of the future pilots will just be happy to be at AA and will not have some outside perspective similar to a DL or UA QoL. This worries me because I honestly won’t know exactly what it’s like over there. All I’ll know is my seniority is moving quicker than my contemporaries hired at the other 2 and that I have on average 4 more days off a month. I won’t be only flying 4 on 2 off 4 on 2 off crediting 75-80 hours tops a month. I’ll be making triple what I am at a regional while working a lot less in 2 years. So I don’t know how we fight to improve QoL to be on par with DL and UA (which I won’t even know what theirs is) when a majority of the future pilots are getting their biggest QoL and pay upgrades of their lives.

I don't even know what you just said. I'm not going to get 20 years of what? If I go to 65 I will have worked at AA for just under 30 years. If you add my previous airline experience it will make 38 years. If you add 135 40 years.

I have been through 3 section 6s if you count AA's current and seen now 3 different unions with interact with management with many different leadership changes along the way with their own methods and strategies. I may not be a grizzled old vet but I am in no way a "newbie." You guys see someone young-ish and decide they know nothing and have seen nothing.

I'm not talking trash I'm making an observation. I have conversations while I fly across the country for 5 hours. I have also watched what has gone on at APA since I've been here. From this I have formed an opinion. Since my opinion is not "how we've always done it" and I'm under 50 years old I guess it's incorrect.

Well, we are pilots, complaining is what we do. At the end of the day AA is a good job and I am happy here. Way happier than I was at the regional.

That's certainly not unique to AA. For most majors/legacy new hires, QOL is going to be a step up from their previous employer: 91, 121, 135, mil. Some have better aspects than others. None is the complete package, evidenced by the garbage spirit vs. UA vs FEDEX threads, etc. I believe there's a balance between being happy, proud, and content with where you are, but still striving to improve for the benefit of your entire pilot group. Kind of like all industries/work groups; the ones that sit back fat, dumb, and happy eventually get consumed.

Well neither are the "hired at 20" with one job and been here forever. I was hired early but I've experienced three airline "mergers". Not including two commuter, corporate and 135, etc. You make it sound like we're old and have seen nothing.

Well I suppose this is the problem with generalizations that we both made. Not everyone fits the mold.

It’s not that the old guys “know nothing.” Clearly your demographic has seen just about all the industry has to offer in the way of challenges and pitfalls. But the old guard at AA/USAIR/AWA have, in general, ended up with subpar working conditions for at least the last 20 years relative to our peers. Maybe an injection of new blood or a switch to ALPA will provide the needed change to get an industry standard contract at AAL.

He’s talking about guys that don’t uphold the contract. We’ve got guys bending over to use biz hero and posting it on every internal board (god I hope he’s trolling) when we need to do the opposite. The old guard here (not all) seem to lean forward more often than drive for a better contract.