Atlas Air Hiring
02-08-2014 | 02:30 PM
#7861
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,292
Likes: 2
From: 747
This auto flight discussion should really be for another thread. This thread is for guys that want to get hired at Atlas.
As for the question about EFIS quals on the PAQ, there has been (to my knowledge) no guidance from HR regarding the definition of EFIS on the app.
Whatever you decide to do, simply being able to clarify your "EFIS" experience and explain the functionality of that system clearly should help if it comes up in the interview.
My "EFIS" experience was in a SF-340B. Probably not even as sophisticated as your plane. I included it, it never came up during the interview, and I was hired. YMMV.
8
As for the question about EFIS quals on the PAQ, there has been (to my knowledge) no guidance from HR regarding the definition of EFIS on the app.
Whatever you decide to do, simply being able to clarify your "EFIS" experience and explain the functionality of that system clearly should help if it comes up in the interview.
My "EFIS" experience was in a SF-340B. Probably not even as sophisticated as your plane. I included it, it never came up during the interview, and I was hired. YMMV.
8
02-08-2014 | 06:34 PM
#7862
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 963
Likes: 0
From: What day is it?
I have to respectfully disagree on this one. Hand flying up to cruise proves/provides nothing, as long as you have the FD up and running. In the departure environment, while you're playing pilot, the PM (pilot monitoring) is managing the radios, CDU, MCP and keeping more than an eye on the hand flying going on. Just my opinion.
On the classic, more than a few times, I saw guys aviating to cruise and get so slow we had to descend to get on speed. Mind you, we were hanging on the props, even if on speed, but get behind, even by a few knots and you'd never accelerate.
On the classic, more than a few times, I saw guys aviating to cruise and get so slow we had to descend to get on speed. Mind you, we were hanging on the props, even if on speed, but get behind, even by a few knots and you'd never accelerate.
The ability to hand fly without relying on magic goes directly to the heart of the issue. At the end of the day, you can train anyone to punch buttons and turn knobs. You can't teach them flying skills if they don't have a solid foundation in fundamentals.
Your point about guys who aviate to cruise and have to step the plane to get on speed goes to the heart of the matter. A pilot who doesn't see that in his climb and adjust to keep his speed in the climb is one who will not notice an autopilot that may be out of trim as fast as someone who has a good feel of the plane in all regimes. Consider the American Eagle ATR and the Continental Express Dash 8. Look at Air France. Over reliance on magic and lack of attention, coupled with poor inputs when the A/P became overtaxed, kicked itself off and said, "you fix it," is a fundamental problem in todays environment and one of the reasons the FAA is looking to see changes on training.
And in that regard, a person with limited EFIS time and more steam and stick time in the end, is likely a better qualified person in terms of experience than someone who has spent their career turning the A/P on at 500', mashing buttons and sailing along spending little time actually manipulating the controls.
It's like an old WWII and Korean war fighter pilot who flew with Yeager told me as a kid, "if you're not in the clouds, it's not IFR. If it's VFR at altitude, it's VFR on top, not actual IFR. Don't get lazy and count it or it will bite you in the can when you least want it to."
That said...good luck Strut!
02-08-2014 | 07:38 PM
#7863
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
From: Chief Pilot
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whaledriver
I have to respectfully disagree on this one. Hand flying up to cruise proves/provides nothing, as long as you have the FD up and running. In the departure environment, while you're playing pilot, the PM (pilot monitoring) is managing the radios, CDU, MCP and keeping more than an eye on the hand flying going on. Just my opinion.
On the classic, more than a few times, I saw guys aviating to cruise and get so slow we had to descend to get on speed. Mind you, we were hanging on the props, even if on speed, but get behind, even by a few knots and you'd never accelerate.
With respect to DC8's post...this is a relevant discussion here as it relates to what is considered in an applicants background.
The ability to hand fly without relying on magic goes directly to the heart of the issue. At the end of the day, you can train anyone to punch buttons and turn knobs. You can't teach them flying skills if they don't have a solid foundation in fundamentals.
Your point about guys who aviate to cruise and have to step the plane to get on speed goes to the heart of the matter. A pilot who doesn't see that in his climb and adjust to keep his speed in the climb is one who will not notice an autopilot that may be out of trim as fast as someone who has a good feel of the plane in all regimes. Consider the American Eagle ATR and the Continental Express Dash 8. Look at Air France. Over reliance on magic and lack of attention, coupled with poor inputs when the A/P became overtaxed, kicked itself off and said, "you fix it," is a fundamental problem in todays environment and one of the reasons the FAA is looking to see changes on training.
And in that regard, a person with limited EFIS time and more steam and stick time in the end, is likely a better qualified person in terms of experience than someone who has spent their career turning the A/P on at 500', mashing buttons and sailing along spending little time actually manipulating the controls.
It's like an old WWII and Korean war fighter pilot who flew with Yeager told me as a kid, "if you're not in the clouds, it's not IFR. If it's VFR at altitude, it's VFR on top, not actual IFR. Don't get lazy and count it or it will bite you in the can when you least want it to."
That said...good luck Strut!
Originally Posted by Whaledriver
I have to respectfully disagree on this one. Hand flying up to cruise proves/provides nothing, as long as you have the FD up and running. In the departure environment, while you're playing pilot, the PM (pilot monitoring) is managing the radios, CDU, MCP and keeping more than an eye on the hand flying going on. Just my opinion.
On the classic, more than a few times, I saw guys aviating to cruise and get so slow we had to descend to get on speed. Mind you, we were hanging on the props, even if on speed, but get behind, even by a few knots and you'd never accelerate.
With respect to DC8's post...this is a relevant discussion here as it relates to what is considered in an applicants background.
The ability to hand fly without relying on magic goes directly to the heart of the issue. At the end of the day, you can train anyone to punch buttons and turn knobs. You can't teach them flying skills if they don't have a solid foundation in fundamentals.
Your point about guys who aviate to cruise and have to step the plane to get on speed goes to the heart of the matter. A pilot who doesn't see that in his climb and adjust to keep his speed in the climb is one who will not notice an autopilot that may be out of trim as fast as someone who has a good feel of the plane in all regimes. Consider the American Eagle ATR and the Continental Express Dash 8. Look at Air France. Over reliance on magic and lack of attention, coupled with poor inputs when the A/P became overtaxed, kicked itself off and said, "you fix it," is a fundamental problem in todays environment and one of the reasons the FAA is looking to see changes on training.
And in that regard, a person with limited EFIS time and more steam and stick time in the end, is likely a better qualified person in terms of experience than someone who has spent their career turning the A/P on at 500', mashing buttons and sailing along spending little time actually manipulating the controls.
It's like an old WWII and Korean war fighter pilot who flew with Yeager told me as a kid, "if you're not in the clouds, it's not IFR. If it's VFR at altitude, it's VFR on top, not actual IFR. Don't get lazy and count it or it will bite you in the can when you least want it to."
That said...good luck Strut!
02-09-2014 | 01:31 AM
#7865
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 4,772
Likes: 1
From: 744 CA
Maybe if the Asiana crew had better "hand" skills... well you get the idea. Being a classic driver I am going to chime in...nothing ****es me off more than to see pilots... CAs and FOs who turn the AP on as soon as the flaps are retracted and turn it off nearly in the flare..... these guys invariably have NO skill left and make the crappiest landings. I value ALL these attributes.. flying skills AND the ability to run/manage the FMS/CDU etc....
02-09-2014 | 01:32 AM
#7866
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 4,772
Likes: 1
From: 744 CA
FWIW...when we have hired in the past... or transitioned qualified FEs to the right seat K4 still requires a basic sim eval flown with no AP, no FD raw data holding and basic flying skills and an ILS to near mins.... if you can't do that... please move on.
02-09-2014 | 05:24 AM
#7867
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,414
Likes: 0
From: Heavies
I'm out on mil but I just checked the bid packages to see what i can expect when I go back. What happened to the 767 flying? JFK has 3 lines and all r2 in Cvg and cvg seems to have lost a bunch of the DHL lines I used to fly with a ton of r2 also. Do we just have r2 people sitting everywhere now?
02-09-2014 | 05:42 AM
#7868
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,203
Likes: 0
From: Hot tub for now
Maybe if the Asiana crew had better "hand" skills... well you get the idea. Being a classic driver I am going to chime in...nothing ****es me off more than to see pilots... CAs and FOs who turn the AP on as soon as the flaps are retracted and turn it off nearly in the flare..... these guys invariably have NO skill left and make the crappiest landings. I value ALL these attributes.. flying skills AND the ability to run/manage the FMS/CDU etc....
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