Originally Posted by JackStraw

You mean Solidarity like crossing a picket line?

Originally Posted by Boris Badenov

I'm totally out of my depth on that one, Jack, and I freely admit it. My understanding is that a very small number of ATI pilots crossed a picket line they'd been told *by their own Union* to cross. But I stand open to correction on that point. I'm not taking a side, here, just saying how it seems to me. If I'm wrong, tell me why, and if I agree that I am, I'll thank you for the education.

Originally Posted by JackStraw

*by their own union*

That makes it pretty clear.

Originally Posted by Boris Badenov

I'm totally out of my depth on that one, Jack, and I freely admit it. My understanding is that a very small number of ATI pilots crossed a picket line they'd been told *by their own Union* to cross. But I stand open to correction on that point. I'm not taking a side, here, just saying how it seems to me. If I'm wrong, tell me why, and if I agree that I am, I'll thank you for the education.

Originally Posted by hackerbyday

It wasn’t their union that told them to cross it was the offer of overtime that got them to cross. What’s worse being a ***** or a Scab. When crossing a picket line I think both are equal.

Originally Posted by OverGMcGee

You must be union! How did you know the correct numbers that fast? Mec just put the email out

Originally Posted by cactusmike

I have to laugh at the infighting between you guys. A year ago Atlas was the whipping boy. The year before it was Southern. Before that Kalitta.

If you believe you are going to get solidarity between competing airlines for the same contracts you are mistaken. If you think you are going to get the same money as Fedex, UPS or any of the big 4 pax carriers you are even more mistaken. It takes a company making billions in profits for any of that to trickle down to the pilots.

I follow these threads because I started out in the freight world and I had connections to some of these carriers. I had friends at Emery, DHL, Transcon, Kalitta, ATI and I actually interviewed at ABX back in 1984. After seeing how the ACMI world eats its young I came to the conclusion that although there will always be a need for these carriers, they will always be chasing the same contracts and fighting each other for the same scraps.

Calling other pilot groups sellout and scabs is just wrong. Each group makes the decisions that are best for their pilot group. Each negotiating committee spends hundreds of hours trying to nail every dime they can out of the company. Teamsters or ALPA, the background support from the National Union obtains the best information possible for the companies financials and the ability of the company to pay the contract.

So ATI did not live up to your expectations. Too bad, because it did for 70% of the ATI Pilots. Come down off your high horse. Every pilot group that has been polluting these threads with crap has been on the bottom of the pile. None of you are exactly leading the way here. Be glad for the gains that have been made and be glad that at least the ATI guys and the Omni pilots will be making better money than they were a year ago.

Originally Posted by freighthound

Once again you make the mistake in thinking that it is only ABX folks who are upset, it is the whole ACMI world, (Atlas, Kalitta, Southern, etc). The hard work that the rest of the ACMI industry has done in order to bring this portion of the profession out of the sewer has been set back greatly.

Right now no one is necessarily talking mainline or UPS money, but they are talking Kalitta/Omni money and quality of life. You failed to achieve that mark and that is what people are talking about. So next time please done't mention a comparison with the majors or UPS/Fed Ex. What you need to say is that evidently ATI pilots can never hope to achieve those high wages like Omni and Kalitta.

As far as percentage increase, that is a meaningless number. If you make $10 an hour and you get a 200% increase you still only making $30 an hour. It is the actual dollars that matter not the percentage increase. You also say this is the second biggest increase in the history of ALPA and yet it fell behind the last 2 contracts signed, (Kalitta and Omni), both not negotiated by ALPA...things that make you go humm!