Amazon Single Carrier?
11-23-2020 | 04:11 PM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
What needs to change is the RLA. It was written at a time when you couldn't tell a TWA pilot "take these concessions, or we give your flying to Pan Am." The RLA is designed to promote the status quo. On the rail side it prohibits closing of stations and routes during negotiations. No such protections exist on the air side, they close bases/stations and threaten - or do - transfer flying to other carriers in a whipsaw. The RLA never envisioned the outsourced business model infecting our industry.
The problem is, ALPA and the other union lawyers won't fight to fix it. They've become very comfortable with the current RLA decisions and it makes them confident what will and won't fly (excuse the pun). That said, they've forgotten that they exist to improve our lives, and make our lives easier and more comfortable; not to make it easy for the lawyers.
I literally sat and listened to 3 hours of one lawyer after another at ALPA national explaining why they didn't want to mess with the RLA because they have a really good grasp of how to work within it now. Totally BS arguments. The only argument they put forth that did hold some water was that if the unions want modifications to the RLA, that managements will push to modify things their way, and the lawyers are afraid of what could happen.
The problem is, ALPA and the other union lawyers won't fight to fix it. They've become very comfortable with the current RLA decisions and it makes them confident what will and won't fly (excuse the pun). That said, they've forgotten that they exist to improve our lives, and make our lives easier and more comfortable; not to make it easy for the lawyers.
I literally sat and listened to 3 hours of one lawyer after another at ALPA national explaining why they didn't want to mess with the RLA because they have a really good grasp of how to work within it now. Totally BS arguments. The only argument they put forth that did hold some water was that if the unions want modifications to the RLA, that managements will push to modify things their way, and the lawyers are afraid of what could happen.
11-24-2020 | 11:20 AM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2019
Posts: 1,256
Likes: 0
back to the original post
I am sure the unions will make this a major priority in 2021. Wait for it.
The new political administration will support it, as wealth is a sin and creating innovative business ideas should be outlawed, or at least the riches gained from smart ideas should be re-distributed to the less smart.
Meanwhile, watch out for evil socialist green new deal turboprops.
Evil Jeff links
https://www.smu.edu/News/2017/jeff-b...-smu-09nov2017
https://www.defenseone.com/business/...ntagon/161748/
https://www.geekwire.com/2016/jeff-b...azon-veterans/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...gon-jeff-bezos
Why is Amazon allowed to fly multiple airlines at a time? Isn't this a form of anti-competitive practice (Sherman Anti-trust)? Seems like an uneven playing field when Amazon can "whipsaw" labor negotiations to lower cost. Amazon being the most wealthy company in the world (in all of world history) has an unfair advantage, and its monopoly powers need to be dealt with--before it's too late!
The new political administration will support it, as wealth is a sin and creating innovative business ideas should be outlawed, or at least the riches gained from smart ideas should be re-distributed to the less smart.
Meanwhile, watch out for evil socialist green new deal turboprops.
Evil Jeff links
https://www.smu.edu/News/2017/jeff-b...-smu-09nov2017
https://www.defenseone.com/business/...ntagon/161748/
https://www.geekwire.com/2016/jeff-b...azon-veterans/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...gon-jeff-bezos
11-25-2020 | 05:48 AM
#73
VHR-very happily retired
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,437
Likes: 0
From: Retired
why do you think your union has the right to tell a company that your union does not have a contract with how to do business? Just like you as a consumer have the right to choose fedex, ups, usps, DHL, to send your packages, so does Amazon. They just send more of them. Your union should be more concerned with having a parent company with three airlines.
Also , UPS and FedEx both hire ACMI carriers to fly their freight during peak times.
Also , UPS and FedEx both hire ACMI carriers to fly their freight during peak times.
Only a pilot could be sitting at a buffet in a very good restaurant in a third world country *****ing about the food. I think it is probably pilots who are causing the toilet paper shortage.
11-25-2020 | 05:37 PM
#74
The Fallen Cherub
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 143
Likes: 0
From: Wings & Prayer
11-26-2020 | 05:06 AM
#75
VHR-very happily retired
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,437
Likes: 0
From: Retired
I am not signaling you out as I don’t know you so please don’t be insulted. A lot of pilots have never had another career and had to deal with the trials and tribulations of the everyday grind. For the amount of actual work a pilot does, most are compensated very well. If you have an effective Union, your pay is reflective of your revenue generating potential. (UPS is a good example).
The double edge sword is, that money does not bring career satisfaction. (K4 is an example of an airline that gives you some of both). It is a day to give thanks for the things that are truly important in your life.
11-26-2020 | 08:40 AM
#76
On Reserve
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 31
Likes: 9
back to the original post
I am sure the unions will make this a major priority in 2021. Wait for it.
The new political administration will support it, as wealth is a sin and creating innovative business ideas should be outlawed, or at least the riches gained from smart ideas should be re-distributed to the less smart.
Meanwhile, watch out for evil socialist green new deal turboprops.
Evil Jeff links
https://www.smu.edu/News/2017/jeff-b...-smu-09nov2017
https://www.defenseone.com/business/...ntagon/161748/
https://www.geekwire.com/2016/jeff-b...azon-veterans/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...gon-jeff-bezos
I am sure the unions will make this a major priority in 2021. Wait for it.
The new political administration will support it, as wealth is a sin and creating innovative business ideas should be outlawed, or at least the riches gained from smart ideas should be re-distributed to the less smart.
Meanwhile, watch out for evil socialist green new deal turboprops.
Evil Jeff links
https://www.smu.edu/News/2017/jeff-b...-smu-09nov2017
https://www.defenseone.com/business/...ntagon/161748/
https://www.geekwire.com/2016/jeff-b...azon-veterans/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...gon-jeff-bezos
Is your statement in reference to a specific policy that the Biden White House Administration is currently advocating or developing? Thanks.
11-27-2020 | 06:01 PM
#77
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2020
Posts: 428
Likes: 0
Hey, I know of some examples of retired military who by virtue of their pension chose not to go after the big money. I know of one former air wing commander who became a parking lot attendant. That's not the point, nor the context of this thread. Issue being that some people think they are getting in on the ground floor of "something big" by getting hired by an ACMI operator with Amazon contract. Hoping against hope that somehow Amazon will morph into a single carrier operator, and they will be an urchin turned into a prince. Nope, most likely they got themselves into a perpetual whipsaw game. The best way out of that merry go round (assuming that individual desires a long term airline career) is to get hired by brand name operator.
11-28-2020 | 02:51 AM
#78
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,413
Likes: 0
Why things are the way they are:
FedEx: Born as the original “multimodal transportation system.” In other words, they owned the airline effectively day one.
UPS: UPS started with using contract carriers. They then decided that control was more important than cost (UPS would argue that ultimate control saved money). They purchased one of their feed carriers, Interstate, and started UPS Airlines.
DHL: DHL opted for the multiple carriers approach.
Amazon: Same as DHL
What most people forget is the first (but not the only requirement) for a single carrier is common ownership. Amazon has a minority stake in all the carriers, so there’s no common ownership. Therefore, there’s no single carrier.
What some are hoping for is that Amazon decides to take the UPS route and change their model to support control over cost. IMHO, that’s not going to happen.
FedEx: Born as the original “multimodal transportation system.” In other words, they owned the airline effectively day one.
UPS: UPS started with using contract carriers. They then decided that control was more important than cost (UPS would argue that ultimate control saved money). They purchased one of their feed carriers, Interstate, and started UPS Airlines.
DHL: DHL opted for the multiple carriers approach.
Amazon: Same as DHL
What most people forget is the first (but not the only requirement) for a single carrier is common ownership. Amazon has a minority stake in all the carriers, so there’s no common ownership. Therefore, there’s no single carrier.
What some are hoping for is that Amazon decides to take the UPS route and change their model to support control over cost. IMHO, that’s not going to happen.
11-28-2020 | 10:32 AM
#79
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 542
Likes: 72
My guess is these ACMI carriers end up playing the regional whipsaw game as the Boomers age out and labor supply back fills in from Gen Z types. Unless one of the carriers really ****es AMZN management off, they probably keep getting varying sized slices of the pie. Eventually when some combination of new entrants and regulation force a reorganization of the Amazon model, someone or someones get the XJT/Compass/TSA treatment.
11-28-2020 | 10:37 AM
#80
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 2,174
Likes: 1
Amazon Single Carrier?
Why things are the way they are:
FedEx: Born as the original “multimodal transportation system.” In other words, they owned the airline effectively day one.
UPS: UPS started with using contract carriers. They then decided that control was more important than cost (UPS would argue that ultimate control saved money). They purchased one of their feed carriers, Interstate, and started UPS Airlines.
DHL: DHL opted for the multiple carriers approach.
Amazon: Same as DHL
What most people forget is the first (but not the only requirement) for a single carrier is common ownership. Amazon has a minority stake in all the carriers, so there’s no common ownership. Therefore, there’s no single carrier.
What some are hoping for is that Amazon decides to take the UPS route and change their model to support control over cost. IMHO, that’s not going to happen.
FedEx: Born as the original “multimodal transportation system.” In other words, they owned the airline effectively day one.
UPS: UPS started with using contract carriers. They then decided that control was more important than cost (UPS would argue that ultimate control saved money). They purchased one of their feed carriers, Interstate, and started UPS Airlines.
DHL: DHL opted for the multiple carriers approach.
Amazon: Same as DHL
What most people forget is the first (but not the only requirement) for a single carrier is common ownership. Amazon has a minority stake in all the carriers, so there’s no common ownership. Therefore, there’s no single carrier.
What some are hoping for is that Amazon decides to take the UPS route and change their model to support control over cost. IMHO, that’s not going to happen.
It’s not just common ownership. It also requires common operational control. Each one of these airlines can be owned by the same parent company but unless there is common operational control being exercised on all the airlines, there isn’t a single transportation system.
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