Two Feb 2014 hires awarded MD88 Capt in NYC on latest system bid.

Yeah yeah yeah....its a junior base, quality of life is tough, they'll be on the bottom forever....

But dang...captain at Legacy in 2 years. Interesting times...

 

I swear Albie should apply at Delta he speaks so highly of it so often. My two cents - you will not make nearly what you do at Fedex with synthetic time on deadheads, wide body in second year, revisions, etc. And you will spend about 90 block hours a month airborne versus about 30 if you play it right at FedEx. Boom!

 

But he got his and lie flat seats so what do you expect?

I doubt the OP is still here but hopefully packing for a new hire class at either place.

There is a reason why MD88 Captain seats went junior at DL, nobody with seniority wanted them.

 

The best place to get hired varies by date.

Best place for about 10-15 years was FedEx or SWA. It was certainly the best for place for me, for a variety of reasons.

What concerns me, however, is the idea that "well...it was awesome for me to get hired here in 1995, so it should be no-brainer you will be better off in 2016 at FedEx that you will at Delta/American/etc..."

Delta is going to hire 1000 this year, as is UAL. SWA maybe 650. We might get 400. For those other guys who will not get hired here, or get turned down, what would you recommend? UPS? Giving up?

I am pretty proud to be here, and quite frankly I think I made the OPTIMUM decision a guy getting hired in 2002 could have made. I am just not sure what the OPTIMUM decision is in 2016. When I talk about FedEx, I often tell people some of the thing many of you say....never did many hub turns, usually did international, etc etc. At the same time, looking at our bidpack, some poor *(& is doing that stuff. Some pilots like it, some don't . The awesome thing about 2016 is guys may have a choice, which is good for them, and good for us--since we get pilots who want to be here, vice pilots who simply took the only or best job available. Plenty of guys are purple kool aid drinkers, and I say God Bless every one of them. I'm glad to be here, and enjoy flying with guys who feel the same way.

Nobody is dismissing your wisdom or prowess for choosing FedEx. Its a fantastic place, and with maybe 1/3 of the fleet 757s there are a lot of widebody seats to fill. If you want to work in an FDA...there aren't many other companies that offer that experience. If you really hate airports, flight attendants, and the traveling public we can insulate you from many of those aggravations. Its a damn good gig.

But if you ask me, living on Long Island, or an apartment in Summit NJ, making 200k as a captain out of NYC and non-reving around the country and world on your days off doesn't exactly sound like breaking rocks in the hot sun either. I've gone skiing in Salt Lake with several Delta friends... Making 175k as a WB FO at FedEx is dang cool. Green slipping and skiing on reserve out of SLC probably doesn't suck either. Got a new hire friend living in his hometown of DTW after 20 years of service, and he is thrilled to be back with family. If I offered him 20-40k more a year to leave Delta and come here, he wouldn't punch me...but he is not leaving. Ditto for a colleague flying out of MSP who has a wife with practice in the state. Saying "there are some new options I haven't seen in years...." for some guys doesn't mean I have Delta envy. It means I can look at the world from a 2016 lens instead of looking backwards and recognize opportunities.

Everyone finds their niche. 777 guys fly more block, but get to see the world and rake in some block over 8. I enjoyed that type flying in the -11, and know I'd do a lot less--if any--of that at Delta. Other guys here have bragged about how little block they fly on the TYS, CHA, BHM, or TLH hub turns. That's true...but I've done BHM and TLH for a week here or there, and by Thursday felt like complete hell. 45 minutes of block between 4 and 6 am sucks. It sucks less than 3 hours block to GTF, that kind of flying was mortifyingly miserable to me. DHing to Paris for an 8 hour block trip to IND? Heck yeah...sign me up. But our flying is so good and so awful its sort of hard to compare to the typical airline flying. Weekend layovers are great, but if I had to do 3 days of hubturns to get it maybe I'd rather just fly days instead.

In 2005, guys were bailing to leave Delta to come to Fedex, or taking retirement and getting out of the industry or flying for fractionals. The business is cyclic anyway, and the 2000 stock market crash and 9/11 crushed the industry. That doesn't mean, however, that legacies are doomed. They have consolidated, cut capacity, and adjusted to the new world order. Will the ride get bumpy at times? History says it probably will. Even so, being an airline pilot for a legacy might still be a better fit for some out there, especially if they have some risk mitigators like a working spouse, ANG gig, etc. I'm glad there are some good guys who want to fly for Delta instead of us--because they are flying my kids around the world. I hope the pilots that are doing that enjoy the hell out of the job and make a great living at it.

And for guys on the street--you haven't had these kind of choices in almost two decades. Good luck whatever you decide.

 

Wise words Albie

 

Fedex is arguably still the best job in the industry. It was my number one choice for the 13 years i updated quarterly, the two years i stayed current to interview, and the two plus years i treaded in the pool. Then i turned them down.

Why? Because when you start to look at each individual's situation based on age/prospects, where and how you want to live and work, and compensation over your time left to work, it is not always a no brainer for Fedex. Although for most it is.

Fedex may be the most commutable job in the majors (maybe not for new hires) and with my kids grown and having lived in Memphis area previously, was willing to move there. But lots of friends commute there with little problems. Besides Guam at UAL ,nobody else offers FDA if that is your speed.

Fedex pay, work rules, no PBS, and percentage of wide bodies are pretty much top of the game. Vacation drop and amount of flying you actually do vs what you get paid is pretty eye opening. If you are under 45 you really need to have a good reason like Albie said to not go purple.

That DB Retirement, while probably not increasing, is a huge plus. But you gotta be there 20 years and have a good high 5 to optimize it.

And there lied the rub for me. Am older and not going have a lot of years on the property, and probably not going to make captain there and if so not for long. Wife is Airline Brat who rekindled her love for non revving. Grown kids settled in a State outside of Tennessee, and all the things i thought i would hate about the pax business like people, airports, FAs, and hats, haven't been as annoying as i thought. To be honest i really liked my job even when i commuted, and now living in base is a whole new level of good. And the 1500+ below me at the major where i work cannot be ignored. Believe it or not i have to fly at night a fair amount. But that usually turns my 4 day into a 3 day starting the trip or ending the trip with a redeye. With an almost 3 year head start i do better financially where i am at both in compensation and retirement(Maxing my 401k and B fund is 16%). Crunched the numbers many times to verify this, and even after your awesome pay raise this still holds. On track to be a Captain 9-10 years from hire. Not important for everybody but i like having that goal out there. Shoot me. And wife is very, very happy.

And the balloon could go up and it all comes crumbling down.

 

Very thoughtful posts by Albie and Dragon. If one has the choice, they should really consider these kind of issues. Unfortunately, most people don't have access to such detailed information.

 

Exactly, thanks!
And most people also don't have the privilege of choosing which amazing job they want.

 

More and more are!

Information is out there. Read forums and ask. Not all differences matter between options, but some might.

Location, loCATION, LOCATION!!!

 

You guys keep comparing 1000/1500 hires at Delta as more than Fedex. FedEx is a 4300 pilot seniority list versus 12K pilots at Delta. Proportionally it's identical what's happening with the hiring. The Vietman era guys are timing out...everywhere. The idea that Delta is hiring more is so misleading and its plastered all over this forum.

All these Delta dudes admit that they fly red eyes on a regular basis. PBS. Less pay per day on an hourly basis. No pension. Yes, I'm biased but happy with my choice. And I don't spend an entire work week a month airborne. Not even close.