"..with you..."
12-01-2006 | 09:14 PM
#51
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Joined: Nov 2006
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Using "and" is left over from the old days, when there would be a noticable delay from the time you hit the transmit button and the time it transmits, so what you would do is say "and approach..." because the "and" would not be transmitted due to the delay. This way what you wanted to say would not be partially transmitted.
You don't have to do it anymore because of improvements made.
You don't have to do it anymore because of improvements made.
I always assumed that this was the origin of "annnddd..."
12-02-2006 | 10:21 AM
#52
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From: Looking for "Confirm Engine Out" button
'with you..."
F14 Tomcat: "Pax River tower, Maverick's with you, requesting high speed fly-by."
Twr: "Negative Ghostrider, the pattern is empty, but because of your incorrect phraseology, fly-by is denied."
Maverick: ' That SOB cut me off."
Twr: "Negative Ghostrider, the pattern is empty, but because of your incorrect phraseology, fly-by is denied."
Maverick: ' That SOB cut me off."
12-03-2006 | 10:16 PM
#53
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From: Retired
Thanks, I have the 06 FAR/AIM, you must have the 07 one. I don't see what's wrong with this term, it is the fastest way to gain situational awareness upon entering the pattern, as otherwise you have to wait until the traffic makes their next call. And some pilots don't like making radio calls at all, I've had cases where I said "Any traffic in the area, please advise," and another plane in the pattern, after stating his position, also said that there was a third airplane on downwind who wasn't using his radio (or didn't have one). But, I digress. Thanks for the heads up, though.
http://www.avweb.com/news/pilotlounge/183931-1.html
12-04-2006 | 07:00 AM
#54
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Was it from a radio transmit delay, or from a delay in the voice activated intercom used in-cockpit? I remember back in the days, using an intercom and having to make some kind of noise to get the system to activate, but if you just started talking it would ...ut off the first part of the first word.
I always assumed that this was the origin of "annnddd..."
I always assumed that this was the origin of "annnddd..."
12-04-2006 | 09:36 AM
#55
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Thanks, I have the 06 FAR/AIM, you must have the 07 one. I don't see what's wrong with this term, it is the fastest way to gain situational awareness upon entering the pattern, as otherwise you have to wait until the traffic makes their next call. And some pilots don't like making radio calls at all, I've had cases where I said "Any traffic in the area, please advise," and another plane in the pattern, after stating his position, also said that there was a third airplane on downwind who wasn't using his radio (or didn't have one). But, I digress. Thanks for the heads up, though.
12-05-2006 | 05:32 PM
#56
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Don Brown was an ATL center controller that has some really great articles on this subject. He writes on the AVweb site. If you have some extra time, check it out....
http://www.avweb.com/news/sayagain/list.html
you have to register for free to read....
http://www.avweb.com/news/sayagain/list.html
you have to register for free to read....
12-06-2006 | 02:47 PM
#57
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Get over it, smartboy. "with you" can actually serve a purpose.
It works nicely as a separater between your flight number and altitude. Sure, "flight level" will separate the flight number from the altitude,
i.e., "Abex four forty flight level three eight zero"
but "with you" is shorter, and somehow easier to get out quickly.
How about this.... "Abex four forty one seven thousand"
Was that ABX 441 at 7000? or ABX 440 at 17000?
Stick a "with you" in there and there's no confusion.
It works nicely as a separater between your flight number and altitude. Sure, "flight level" will separate the flight number from the altitude,
i.e., "Abex four forty flight level three eight zero"
but "with you" is shorter, and somehow easier to get out quickly.
How about this.... "Abex four forty one seven thousand"
Was that ABX 441 at 7000? or ABX 440 at 17000?
Stick a "with you" in there and there's no confusion.
12-07-2006 | 09:56 AM
#58
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From: FO - 757/767
Actually grady I have "bashed" airline pilots on the same subject.
I have the same respect for all pilot groups...wasn't bashing any one of them. I already went thru the airline pilot forums pointing out the same ridiculous absurdity of "...with you".
To make you happy I removed any reference to the aircraft type I fly.
Another thing -- ATC points out on-coming traffic at the flight levels simply so you won't be alarmed thinking he's at the same altitude. A simple "thank you" or "in sight" in the inital reply is fine but there is no need to later clog up the frequency to tell him you finally have the traffic in sight -- he doesn't care one iota. I have seen a lot of blocked calls because guys think they need to later tell center they have traffic in sight.
I have the same respect for all pilot groups...wasn't bashing any one of them. I already went thru the airline pilot forums pointing out the same ridiculous absurdity of "...with you".
To make you happy I removed any reference to the aircraft type I fly.
Another thing -- ATC points out on-coming traffic at the flight levels simply so you won't be alarmed thinking he's at the same altitude. A simple "thank you" or "in sight" in the inital reply is fine but there is no need to later clog up the frequency to tell him you finally have the traffic in sight -- he doesn't care one iota. I have seen a lot of blocked calls because guys think they need to later tell center they have traffic in sight.
12-09-2006 | 02:19 PM
#59
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From: 747
5-3-3. Additional Reports
a. The following reports should be made to ATC or FSS facilities without a specific ATC request:
1. At all times.
(a) When vacating any previously assigned altitude or flight level for a newly assigned altitude or flight level.
I don't like to make that report either, but it is right there in black and white.
12-10-2006 | 05:40 PM
#60
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From: 777 Capt
That said, I agree with you its not 'AIM correct'. My only point remains that "with you" can serve a purpose; it's not as dumb as some people claim. But sticking with the standard vernacular is never a bad idea.
