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Old 01-10-2024 | 07:57 AM
  #4021  
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Originally Posted by Gunfighter
Staffing models would get interesting when you start accounting for rest requirements including the pre trip DH. FRMS gets even more inefficient, just ask any ATL 777 pilot who flew SYD before the LAX base opened. Any ideas on how LC reserve could be implemented? The time to push for a change is when we are fat on pilot staffing and can absorb the initial inefficiency. It's a concept with merit and might even gain consideration when we realize much of the "base" function can be replaced with technology.
I'm not on a WB so I don't know the logistics of FRMS. However, I do know in the past management was willing to eat a lot of inefficiencies related to WB crew and aircraft movement. 777 to FL, 3 man crews DHing the 3rd all over Asia and back, A350 doing domestic out of MSP (330 base) etc. If a cost arguement could be made, especially now with EDP and other costs overshadowing DH costs it could be done. The A350 FRMS is a one off problem relative to the rest of the airline. Yes, it needs to be dealt with but shouldn't be a show stopper.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 08:07 AM
  #4022  
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
You're missing the point. I would have NO problem with Flight Ops bringing in those individual offenders, givig a harsh warning, and then some serious time off if those individuals do it again. Even send out a broadcast Must-read APB about it. But no, Flight Ops likes to hold all 17,000 of us equally accountable for a handful of individual offenders.

It's exactly the same with those who blatantly abuse sick leave. Or the whale pilots who didn't commute in for Short Call - for years. Go after the individual offenders, instead of making the rest of us wear diapers [or sit all (then) 7 Short Calls all summer after to prove a point].

I play by the rules, and it frankly pizzes me off that all of us have to deal with the fallout from those among us who blatantly don't.
How can they punish a pilot for complying with the policy that was in effect?
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Old 01-10-2024 | 08:14 AM
  #4023  
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Originally Posted by sailingfun
How can they punish a pilot for complying with the policy that was in effect?
The policy has always been that the pilot was supposed to be on a flight that arrived with adequate time to report. Certainly the company could have said arriving on a flight with a scheduled arrival at or after the show time of their rotation was not adequate. But as I said, not all the issues were scheduling. Delta flights were delayed HOURS. Even a pilot with 1 or 2 backups would have missed their report.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 08:16 AM
  #4024  
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
You're missing the point. I would have NO problem with Flight Ops bringing in those individual offenders, givig a harsh warning, and then some serious time off if those individuals do it again. Even send out a broadcast Must-read APB about it. But no, Flight Ops likes to hold all 17,000 of us equally accountable for a handful of individual offenders.
That offending behavior is perfectly legal and contractually protected at AA. I think we need to start examining our industry-last PWA commuter clause before we start blaming ourselves.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 08:18 AM
  #4025  
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Originally Posted by ancman
That offending behavior is perfectly legal and contractually protected at AA. I think we need to start examining our industry-last PWA commuter clause before we start blaming ourselves.
So we are on the same page, what behavior is legal and protected at AA?
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Old 01-10-2024 | 08:26 AM
  #4026  
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Originally Posted by CBreezy
So we are on the same page, what behavior is legal and protected at AA?
Commuting to work (even on an off-line carrier), with no backup or specific buffer required.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 09:04 AM
  #4027  
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Originally Posted by ancman
Commuting to work (even on an off-line carrier), with no backup or specific buffer required.
As long as the flight is scheduled to arrive before the show time of their trip. I'm not arguing that.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 09:06 AM
  #4028  
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Originally Posted by FangsF15
You're missing the point. I would have NO problem with Flight Ops bringing in those individual offenders, givig a harsh warning, and then some serious time off if those individuals do it again. Even send out a broadcast Must-read APB about it. But no, Flight Ops likes to hold all 17,000 of us equally accountable for a handful of individual offenders.

It's exactly the same with those who blatantly abuse sick leave. Or the whale pilots who didn't commute in for Short Call - for years. Go after the individual offenders, instead of making the rest of us wear diapers [or sit all (then) 7 Short Calls all summer after to prove a point].

I play by the rules, and it frankly pizzes me off that all of us have to deal with the fallout from those among us who blatantly don't.
You need to preface "offenders" with "alleged". We have no facts behind this other than apocryphal stories from management types and their sympathizers, including former and ejected union types and their sympathizers. Some of whom are retired.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 09:24 AM
  #4029  
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At a minimum PS needed to be limited to your base (or out of base pickup) and the general vicinity of your home. No PS to/from Europe/SA/Asia at the start of end of your rotation when you live in Tulsa. Have a system where if you're visiting your parents or whoever in XYZ city you can request PS on a one-off exception not to/from your home. That policy alone would have cut down on a lot of the actual abuse of PS. Using PS during the day between lean overs isn't abuse in my mind. It is heavy useage, but not abuse. Going to Rome at the end of a 4-day is abuse.
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Old 01-10-2024 | 09:28 AM
  #4030  
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Originally Posted by myrkridia
I hope when I retire I don't find a hobby out of blaming pilots for changes in company policies. PSC was a cost for the company, our NC didn't find it prudent to negotiate for such a high cost item given their other priorities this cycle. It's that simple, we are worth what we are able to negotiate.
This here is the primary reason it went away. That cost to negotiate, according to PB in the lounge, was about 800,000 seats per month of revenue.
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