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04-15-2023, 02:23 PM

#501

PilotBases

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Joined APC: Apr 2020

Posts: 2,189

Quote:

Originally Posted by iaflyer

If we don't buy some Boeing wide bodies soon, eventually Airbus is going to start acting like a monopoly and start pricing accordingly. The last Boeing widebody I think we bought new was the order of 10 B777 that was delivered in 2008-2010...

Fair, but AA/UA are totally content to be 100% B for their WBs.
I could see 787, but I don’t think there’s a chance of 777. 787 to replace 763 and ultimately 764 does align with the “simplification” goal. Two “types” in one.

04-15-2023, 02:38 PM

#502

Rinaldi

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Position: 330B

Posts: 118

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeneralLee

I’ve heard rumblings and wouldn’t be surprised if we see not only a Boeing product, but some 350-1000s as well.

I think this is the likely outcome. We have a need for enough WBs that we can split the order.

04-15-2023, 02:43 PM

#503

PilotBases

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If we do a 1-1 order, that’s 45 jets at top pay replacing 763s at super NB pay, would be interesting to see where WB A falls when all said and done.

04-15-2023, 03:06 PM

#504

DWC CAP10 USAF

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Position: Looking left

Posts: 3,251

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisreedrules

JetBlue doesn’t operate 321NEOs and XLRs across the Atlantic because it’s ideal. It’s just a better option than buying A330s for them.

I mean, no one is operating the XLR…across the Atlantic, Pacific, or domestically.

04-16-2023, 12:39 AM

#505

FL370

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Position: A somewhere

Posts: 393

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeneralLee

My info from top men is that we are not interested in the 777x. Gating issues are a big deal (no pun intended).

787s are very much in play with the RFP.

Any reference to "top men" makes me nauseous. Like being a groupie but worse.

04-16-2023, 03:53 AM

#506

Herkflyr

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Joined APC: Jul 2007

Position: Left seat of a little plane

Posts: 2,397

Quote:

Originally Posted by gloopy

It doesn't matter what their margins are. Only that they are dumping premium supply with no sign of slowing down. Their fares on premium lay flat products are frequently a fraction of what ours are. We ignore them and their endless growth at our peril and one day we will look back on these days where it would have been easy to crush them when we have to deal with a much stronger competitor.

Focusing on quarterly numbers while a competitor grows on their terms in our premium markets will prove to be a bigger mistake than paying bilions for regionals to close them, bowing down to another regional for 300M of our own money to prevent liquidation and selling off hedges right before they spiked in value.

If I remember correctly, you have posted many, many times about how JB is going to eat our lunch everywhere. I almost wonder if you have an above-average obsession with them? I don't think our mgmt is ignoring them. While I still think RA was a better CEO than EB, Ed is a "good" CEO and could even be "great" if he stopped being so infatuated with himself and social/political issues. I remember when SWA announced service to ATL. "They are going to take over the world!" some said. They are a good competitor in ATL, but they haven't eaten our lunch there. We responded appropriately and are still doing quite nicely thank you. If all your JB predictions were true, we'd have left BOS long ago. We're still doing well there, last I checked. It isn't always either-or. JB can have a good business model, AND we can still thrive, and occasionally kick the sh!t out of them when needed. Our mgmt is actually pretty good at that.

04-16-2023, 04:36 AM

#507

JustNarced

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Joined APC: Jan 2022

Position: :)

Posts: 464

Quote:

Originally Posted by PilotBases

If we do a 1-1 order, that’s 45 jets at top pay replacing 763s at super NB pay, would be interesting to see where WB A falls when all said and done.

Early 2007 hires by next year.

04-16-2023, 05:15 AM

#508

PilotBases

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Posts: 2,189

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL370

Any reference to "top men" makes me nauseous. Like being a groupie but worse.

In fairness to GL, he probably has the best rumor track record on here, both for company and ALPA stuff.

04-16-2023, 05:33 AM

#509

gloopy

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Position: window seat

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Quote:

Originally Posted by fadecfault

Huh? That sentence is a head-scratcher. If the margin isn't there, the route isn't sustainable, and it'll disappear. Also, if your argument is that a Skyteam ticket costs too much, it seems a bit misleading to compare pricing on individual legs; real world pax flying with one of the immunized JVs are likely connecting at least once via a much deeper network than B6 alone can offer. That convenience naturally commands a premium.

Of course, each of the big 3 should be keeping a close eye on B6 and Norse/Play/et al., but so far the threat hasn't demonstrated any teeth.

All their margin has to be is either break even or even a tolerable loss they can amortie across the rest of their network.

Over focusing on per flight profitability for per quarter numbers is how you let a ruthless competitor grow to critical mass right under your nose. But that's tomorrow guy's problem isn't it?

04-16-2023, 05:36 AM

#510

gloopy

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Position: window seat

Posts: 12,522

Quote:

Originally Posted by iaflyer

We don't have to order them as long as someone does. Has SWA been overpaying for Boeings with their "monopoly" over them?

We're probably all getting gouged with the existing duopoly anyway.