Thanks, guys for doing the heavy lifting. Hopefully we’ll raise the tide on ours at UA.

The non retro-retro is lump sump based on 4% of a pilot’s earnings in 2020, 4% of 2021, and 14% of 2022. Will be paid out within 30 days of ratification. There is no 16% DC on that lump sum hence the “no retro” nomenclature, but that lump sum does count as eligible earnings when they calculate our profit sharing for the year, which will pay out in Feb 2024.

4 years: amendable 31 Dec 2026

Contract 2019 page with clean and marked up versions of contract, negotiator notepads, and video of one of the roadshows found here: https://contract2019.org

This thread has achieved its life expectancy.

Takeaway: TA passed by effectively 100% consensus.

25% are incapable of voting yes and joining the consensus. This has nothing to do with merit or lack thereof of any potential agreement. It’s a personality issue. It applies across the board throughout society whenever a large group is polled or casts a vote.

I completely agree with you and tried to explain repeatedly on here how time and the process would work. No one wanted to listen.

Yes, agree;
once again the music stopped,
this is the chair we got.

Now it’s time to focus on implementing what we have.

Lets fire outside the circle.

Except a lot of the propaganda that your company moles repeatedly fed you along the way was not accurate. Including that our initial ask in 2019 was something like “25/10/10”. That’s verifiable nonsense, confirmed by several sources.

And Covid was responsible for 2 years of the delay, a relevant fact missing from your narrative every time you pat yourself on the back for demanding an on-time contract.

ALPA took the long road and made improvements in nearly every section of the contract, without giving things away to grease the skids. It had to happen, and was never going to be quick. You’re probably right about one thing though- if they had just proposed an extension with modest pay raises back in 2019, it could have been done quicker.

An 8/4/3/3 deal gets us right back to where we are today at 18%, but none of the heavy lifting which makes up the bulk of the value of this agreement would have been done.

Do you see any value at all in gains to scope, vacation, training, deadhead, sick, scheduling, reserve, rotation construction, medical insurance, retirement, crew meals, per diem, instructor/LCA, maternity, AE bidding, etc etc etc?

Or is it all about Section 3 and TVM?

The highest number I ever heard was 20/8/8 but am now told it was 16/8/8. The total of over 3 billion was not non sense and dead on. Now that the contract is done ask your reps. You can also simply look at the parts of the opener that were published and reach a logical conclusion. What happened to that 25% DC/MCBP and 260 hours of vacation with a equal distribution of weeks? From a 3 billion plus opener in year one to 150 million one time payment! We got them!

Lets look big picture here. About every 10 years we have a "Black Swan" event that management uses very effectively against labor. Early 1990s - war and recession resulting in POS C-96 and furloughs. 9-11 resulting in furloughs, LOA-46, BK, and finally LOA-51, pretty much the nadir of the industry. 2008 financial crisis that management really couldn't maximize to their advantage since labor was already at the 9-11 low. Covid - resulting in UNAs, not furloughs, and a mutually agreed upon 2 year pause in negotiations.

Now who in the industry has raised the bar this friggin century? UAL in 2000 and since then, drum-roll please............................... us, the Delta Pilots. We have been consistently agreeing to serious productivity work rule concessions back to and including C-2000, yes C2000 in which we were blindsided by RJs and opened the door for that whole fiasco. And I am talking real concessions, not imaginary ones like since we did not get X - that is a concession. UAL and AAL pilots never really had to bargain much for rates they just matched us and concentrated on work rules QOL etc and wisely included snap ups in their deals as they will currently.

So we didn't achieve full retro - yes that sucks, but we did get a partial non retro sort of retro signing bonus. When you look at the outcome of all the airline Black Swan events we clearly came out of this the best and primarily, IMHO, becasue of supply and demand. If there was not a serious Pilot shortage this contract would have looked a lot different, and by that I mean crappy at the historical norms of Black Swan PWAs. As much as we think we can just bargain a little harder with a little more backbone and get what we demand, we are severely limited by two main factors the RLA and supply and demand.

So while not perfect, I will take this as a win, look forward to my non-retro sort of retro bonus and feel very confident that we set zero precedent as far as retro goes. We got 100% retro in 2016 - did that set a precedent - Hell no! Just as this will not set a precedent - each negotiation is vastly different and the playing field is set by existing market conditions, so yes if there is another Black Swan that delays the PWA for three years we will probably not see full retro but given the historical sub 1 year delay - I'm betting full retro will be required to pass.

Scoop - just my cents.

You weren't the only one. This fact is the one constant. Time is never on labor's side wrt retro pay.

Oh well.

Sailing I like the information that you put out. I also tend to agreed with your conceptual approach to more frequent short duration contracts. That being said short of a contract extension I don’t think we were going to have a TA before the Covid pandemic hit. Our opening position was something to shoot for but i think publishing it was a poor tactic. Unless both sides hand over complete opening positions we are showing our cards. I also believe that the work rules going forward are very important and will become a 3rd rail item in future negotiations, but time will tell. You have said you are short timing it and I hope you continue to provide insights so this isn’t an echo chamber. You are very respectful and measured in your opinions.