Well Said!!!

A much more eloquent and succint way of putting it. What he said!

Lets be honest, JFK is the seventh level of hell and the only reason you are there is because of sins committed in this or another life. Until you seek penance you will continue to pass through and always be at a hard stand. Or be in luck that your plane is at the gate on time, they board on time, but they don't load bags or fuel until 45 minutes past departure time. I got so fed up with it I had to bid to ATL. JFK is worse than any third world airport I've ever been to and the rhetoric about how we need to be the flagship product in NYC is embarrassing when you have any gate assignment that's prefaced by a Terminal 2 or 3.

You are half right New K. You are right that we have to convince the upper segment that we can have scope and increased earnings if we work together. But me as 1.5 year guy getting in his grill and telling him he is wrong would be counter productive. ( not to mention hazardous to my employment:rolleyes:)

Your last statement however, is wrong. How many senior guys are you going to convince to vote with you if you call them scabs for exercising their voting rights in a representative democracy? I think it's a real stretch to think a guy would cross a picket line just because he doesn't agree with scope protection. Would you cross if the issue was a 30% 777/747 increase vs a 50%? It doesn't benefit you and could harm your ability to feed your children. But you would be marching and carrying your sign because that is what we signed up for. I would give any one the same benefit of the doubt.

Our challenge is to convince the seniority and the juniority that scope is in everyone's best interest and yes we can improve everyone's prospects. It doesn't have to be a zero sum game. Hyperbole and invective server neither purpose. I think voting for ACL is a start. We need more people like him to run and get elected. With the accelerated retirement schedule we have an opportunity. As the 2000 hires who were furloughed get more senior and more power our numbers will grow.

So what do you say Tomcat? Are you going to run too?

Satchip,

I didn't say you should get in his grill and call him a scab. I said the reasons you gave for his position were the same a scab would give.

If you have been here 1.5 years, you are off probation, so how is anything you say to a guy hazardous? Every voice counts at this airline. The more the merrier. :)

New K Now

I'm headed to ATL within the next two years. When there, I'll be an active voice and I may well get involved in the union.

Here's the problem..... I wear John Lennon's rose colored glasses.... I think about the big picture and what ALPA should be doing for the entire career path of an Airline Pilot. From the day he thinks about going to training to after he retires. What should the big guys be doing for all of us. I pay my 1.95% and believe it or not, I contribute to ALPA PAC.

What about the young pilots that are commuting all over the country to be on reserve, because his company wins and loses contracts every month and can't keep a base open for more than 6 months. Maybe it's happening, but I'm just not seeing the results. What kind of training is the industry and the company making sure that He/She gets before being put in tough circumstances (e.i.Buffalo)? A CD teaching a pilot about icing conditions before they go out to experience it for the first time?

How about the LCA that is trying to figure out how he's going to get his retirement put back together so his kids don't have to take care of him when he can't make it to the bathroom from old age.

If we're going to have a National Union, shouldn't it try to better define and influence what an Airline Pilots career looks like. What's going to happen to all the pilots that have gotten stuck in the middle of this Scope battle that will never make it to a major carrier? Issues such as training, crew rest, scope, retirement, disability, job security and health should be on the radar at DALPA. Some of these issues are..... but some of them, our union and ALPA National are just turning there heads and pretending like they just are not seeing these issues. It's not addressed with the pilot group in a straight forward manner. Wheres the communication? Who is representing who?

Where I'm planting my flag - Scope! The bottom 30-40% of us are directly effected by this. Career earnings, QOL, etc. Some may argue that it goes up to the 50th percentile.

I'm the guy stuck in the boat in the middle of the Pacific with a group of other guys that's going to firgue out how I survive. I'm going to figure out how we all survive........ I'm still looking through my John Lennon glasses and going to bet that many of you are the same way. What can each of us do to make this better?

Ok, I'm done..... ;) Have a good nite, glad to flying with all of you!:cool:

Respectfully,
TC

Heyas,

I can tell you right now there are at least 2 or 3 people in each category in DTW running this fall that won't play the "acclamation" game, and tell folks what they think, and will follow the lead of the people they represent.

Oh yea, all of them communicate pretty well, so, it will be fun to watch....

Nu

I know where you can get a guaranteed ~350 votes from if you run on that.

Compass pilots get to vote, right? Right?

Most Compass Captains (and FOs) would give their Left Seat (or for FOs, just about everything) to you if you can stop scope erosion.

Thanks.... I really wish I knew what was going on at the MEC level regarding you guys. I don't like what I'm hearing. Perhaps a missed opportunity for all of us. They don't come around very often.

This is one of the smartest posts I've read on this board. Thanks! A tip of the hat to you, sir, and a tip of the pint in my hand!