Airline Pilot Central Forums - Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

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I was told by senior APD that just finished training on the 717 that it would be done in ATL with our instructors.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1329768)

Astute post.

The "new Pinnacle" is the first alter ego incepted through a partnership with management and ALPA. This airline is being created to create new value in outsourcing by reducing regional pay rates and working conditions. This will put pressure on our small jet rates in our next negotiations. If anyone thinks the 717 was anything more than a "kick the 100 seat jet can down the road" fix, they are kidding themselves.

It is so ugly that our own MEC is not particularly upset about being locked out of the room with Delta management. Nobody wants to be the father of this baby.

Allow me to contrast what is happening with what the Comair pilots fought for (and lost).

Comair:

Three way scope negotiations with Comair's MEC, Delta's MEC and Delta management
Joint agreement on scope which bound Delta Air Lines
Increasing pay rates by reducing outsourcing

Pinnacle:

Exclusive negotiations between Pinnacle ALPA and Delta management
Unilateral negotiation on scope which commits Delta Air Lines
Decreasing pay rates which bring pressure on others in the lower tiers of our profession

The biggest differences between Comair (or RJDC) and Pinnacle:

Delta pilots locked out of the room with their own management
Delta scope redefined:
Was all Delta flying (ie "Comair" performed "Delta" flying)
Now, just the flying Delta performs. Permitted flying belongs to someone else and can be committed within their contract

While it is understood why there is no eagerness for the Delta MEC to participate, the redefinition of our scope is really, really, damaging to our long term interests. Potentially, we would not be able to do another Contract 2012 type deal if our permitted flying was committed elsewhere. Worse, what if other pilot groups avail themselves to this new "open door with Delta management" ? Is anything we failed to nail down open game?

I am concerned, actually fearful, of the new strategic direction we are taking here. We Delta pilots are becoming just another provider of Delta flying ... we are losing the distinguishing characteristic that has made us preeminent on the Delta property.

Great post Bar!

This is not something our MEC should be absent from in any way shape or form. Just emailed and left a VM with my rep. Hope all do the same....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1329792)

In other news ... 2014 Corvette Stingray is "appealing." Anyone doing the NAIAS ? Delta is the "Premier Sponsor" but best I can tell that does not mean any non public access to Delta employees. (at my previous employer if we sponsored it, we generally acted liked we owned the place and could get in on non public days )

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/images...004-medium.jpg
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/images...001-medium.jpg

Looks just like a 599.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1329801)

Great post Bar!

This is not something our MEC should be absent from in any way shape or form. Just emailed and left a VM with my rep. Hope all do the same....

I've emailed all my reps twice and still haven't heard from them!

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1329801)

Great post Bar!

This is not something our MEC should be absent from in any way shape or form. Just emailed and left a VM with my rep. Hope all do the same....

ALPA National's attorney(s) have inserted themselves in local politics to undermine the democratic governance of our union. They have advised their client did nothing inappropriate. Our Reps are conflicted and reticent to take real action.

Our union's governance has broken down.

Most of our Reps are former military Officers. They understand the concept of bottom up, grass roots, representation, ... but ... in practice they are more naturally good Officers rather than trouble making union protagonists. Our Reps are good men.*

The powers that be planned this thing so there would be a delay over the Holidays and insufficient time to organize a political response. It will most likely be signed by ALPA's President.

Now it is more a matter of trying to figure out how to minimize the damage ... and nothing quick or easy comes to mind. We don't have the legal foundation to regain the ground we are giving up.

----------

* A dear friend sent me MLK's "Letter from a Birmingham Jail." What is striking about this historical document is what Martin Luther King was replying to .... King's own associates had written a public letter calling his protests "unwise and untimely," that King's protests and mere presence were unwelcome in Alabama.

King replies "I am in Birmingham, because there is injustice here....We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly, affects all indirectly ...." Rev. King outlines the steps in any non violent campaign for reform:

Collect the facts
Negotiation
Self-purification
Direct Action

(paraphrasing) Nonviolent action seeks to create such a crisis and foster such a tension that a community which has refused to negotiate is forced to confront the issue. Action which seeks to dramatize this issue so that it can no longer be ignored.

"We know that freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor, it must be demanded ... I have never been involved in a direct action campaign which was "well timed" .... :) "

"I have reached the regrettable conclusion ... the great stumbling block is the ... moderate who is more devoted to "order" than justice; who constantly says "I agree with the goal you seek, but I can not agree with ... action."
-------

It is worth recalling Reverend King took a bullet for his actions. None of the "moderate" supporters addressed in the letter even got shot at. It probably is not politically smart to call for direct action using ALPA's governing documents to affect change in our union; yet such action is the right thing to do.

( and no, I am in no way comparing our representational struggle with the work of Martin Luther King. I'm just taking some inspiration from a very well reasoned rebuttal to good men who recommended taking no action )

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheyenne (Post 1329769)

In CQ recently, it was explained to me that the pilots going to the 717 will first go through md88 training and then do a 717 differences course. Really doesn't sound all that appealing.

That is not what was told to me by the 717 fleet captain. I emailed him personally to ask that exact question. The 5-day course is only for those already qualified on the 88. Newbies coming from the 767 for example, will go through a full 717 course.

That was as of a month ago at least. Things could have changed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluejuice71 (Post 1329637)

Why would someone in the top 20% on the 7ER FO category bid the 717 when it opens? They have been able to hold 88 CA for awhile and would have done that already if they wanted too.

There is a big difference between being a quite junior captain on the 88, with zero movement the past five years, versus being (supposedly) a lot more senior on the 717, with a rapidly increasing category size over the next couple of years.

Many of us don't have an obsession with wearing five black stripes on our shoulders, especially if by doing so we are junior and staying junior for years on end.

However, the upgrade to captain (complete with higher pay) is a lot more appealing if you are either not junior to begin with (which is what a lot of senior 7ER F/Os are anticipating) or will remain junior for a fairly brief time as your category gets larger and larger about the same time as retirements finally kick in when that process is done, thereby keeping the upward movement continuing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferd149 (Post 1329392)

wow, just an amazing game. Sorry Denny, thought youze guys had it.

Thanks Ferd. Talk about going from a high to a low!!:( Guess it's good I don't bet on teams........only one of the four I thought would make it, did!

Denny

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Originally Posted by sinca3 (Post 1329793)

Anyone in DTW today?

Always here! But Livonia is pretty far away.

I'm not gonna quote that for the mods to spank me, but I just laughed my head off at the comment.