I disagree.

The GS system isn't archaic at all, it's being corrupted by the potential beneficiaries. We choose how much we fly, and we're choosing to be hoars. We're not even using the GS system properly, because 1) we WS before GS even gets a chance to come into play, 2) we have allowed SWP/SWF to obliterate max pick-up restrictions, and 3) we have turned what should extraodinary flying, into a regular occurence.

The GS sytem doesn't benefit only the few: it punishes the hoars. The fix to let it be useful to all has already been implemented: you can't get your second until everyone has a chance to have their first. The reason it doesn't trickle down as intended is that everyone is too busy trying to WS, and pick-up above max limit by using SWP/SWF, and give the company a present. I don't want to reward that behavior: I want to stop it.

In the meantime, if you want to be a hoar, be a hoar, just don't expect compassion. Many of us understand that judicious restrictions on the supply of pilot hours (i.e. not hoaring), would result in advancement for all, and therefore a higher QOL, at the same amount of year-round pay as the hoars seem to require. AND we would get the occasional GS in the busy months.

The GS system isn't archaic. It's just not allowed to work as intended. That pilots would be willing to give up double-pay for a more steady diet of 1.5X pay, at the cost of hoaring above 80 hours, is an insult to the principles of our profession.

Exactly which hubs are we seeing a shift back to mainline? Not SEA, it'll never be a hub regardless of the number of daily departures, SEA can operate sans a narrow body fleet because of outsourcing, LAX is a named exemption for Alaska, Alaska is now moving into SLC, Skywests RJs are getting bigger and more plentiful in SLC and Pinnacle is dragging their new jumbo RJs and HQ to MSP.

Do you really think the pilots of the worlds (second, soon to be third) largest are all going to fit or want to be based in ATL and NYC? IMHO this contract was about management expanding the domestic outsourcing experiment out west, sustaining the financial viability of DCI and capturing as much international market as possible with minimal capital. DALPA has to figure out as pilots we only have one thing we can sell to management, our flying. Allowing and then justifying the outsourcing of our jobs is extremely narrow minded.

Sorry, got tired if lurking and reading the DALPA responses to legit concerns.

I'm sorry Sink, but its "*****." "Hoar" is that frost we look for on the jet on a cold day in Minny.

And I disagree. The GS process is flawed and benefits only a few....especially in smaller bases.

The reason it only benefits a few, is that there are only a few benefits left. In other words, there is just not that much premium flying leftover, because everyone is taking the flying as a matter of routine. Don't hate the number one guy because he still has scraps left, and the number two guy has nothing left. The truth is the number two guy and the number three guy and the number for guy, have all tripped over themselves to white slip the flying. The green slip system is actually designed to benefit everybody. Everyone gets a shot. There's just nothing to take a shot at anymore.

I am truly amazed at how many guys I fly with whiteslip to the limit every single month. It shows me we are still not making enough money.

All flying over 85 should pay at 1.5, with true OT paying x 2, period. If they are short, they should still have greenslips, but as I posted above anything flown over 85 should pay time and a half.

Or maybe it shows you that people are spending too much money?

I just don't see why we should be fighting over how to routinely pay for an amount of flying we shouldn't routinely cross. And if we cross it because the company badly needs it because they failed to staff up, they need to pay an adequate overage.

If you want to fly more, fly more. Don't ask for special treatment for it.

My guess is a large % of the ALV +15 crowd would pick up to the limit regardless of the rate.

Well, when pilots are still making way less than they did 10 years ago... and everything costs way more than it did back then, well... people need more money.