Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
06-04-2013 | 05:00 PM
Gets Weekends Off
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Now about that hiring that is likely to begin Fall 2012 if this TA passes.....
Last edited by Jack Bauer; 06-04-2013 at 05:11 PM.
06-04-2013 | 05:03 PM
Back on TDY
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From: 747-400 Captain
...and with a surplus of pilots at a system level we have to utilize our existing pilot staffing. As a result, we must displace now in order to staff the hours that Network has given us
So, network gave a need for less hours going forward at a time when we have a system level surplus, operating with our new contract that gave back productivity to fund our COLA pay raises. That's why management won't approve hiring. No mystery there.
Carl
06-04-2013 | 05:06 PM
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No, they didn't say that either. I know because they said this:
...and with a surplus of pilots at a system level we have to utilize our existing pilot staffing. As a result, we must displace now in order to staff the hours that Network has given us
So, network gave a need for less hours going forward at a time when we have a system level surplus, operating with our new contract that gave back productivity to fund our COLA pay raises. That's why management won't approve hiring. No mystery there.
Carl
...and with a surplus of pilots at a system level we have to utilize our existing pilot staffing. As a result, we must displace now in order to staff the hours that Network has given us
So, network gave a need for less hours going forward at a time when we have a system level surplus, operating with our new contract that gave back productivity to fund our COLA pay raises. That's why management won't approve hiring. No mystery there.
Carl
06-04-2013 | 05:06 PM
Line Holder
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From: C560XL/XLS/XLS+
I got it from wiki but I added the 727-200 and 737-200 that was right below it. So it is 54 according to them.
Either way, 54 732s in 2000, 0 now, 0 jumbo RJs then 255 and 70 on order now.
I do remember why I thought the number sounded right because one time when discussing this we also threw in all the DC-9s smaller than the 40 series at NWA in 2000.
Btw, what was the again in wrong again?
Either way, 54 732s in 2000, 0 now, 0 jumbo RJs then 255 and 70 on order now.
I do remember why I thought the number sounded right because one time when discussing this we also threw in all the DC-9s smaller than the 40 series at NWA in 2000.
Btw, what was the again in wrong again?
06-04-2013 | 05:19 PM
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From: 747-400 Captain
06-04-2013 | 05:24 PM
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06-04-2013 | 05:25 PM
veut gagner à la loterie
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From: Light Chop
Just remember that we fly airplanes, we don’t buy them.
And yes I will beat that drum til C2015. Because while I will fly our airplanes for whatever price 50.1% of the pilot group agrees to, I do not want to do another “if you… then we will give you these airplanes to fly”.
That stuff is none of our business. And I think maybe if we get out of that business they won’t take outsourcing to the max allowed out of the fear that we won’t bail them out when outsourcing bites the bottomline as much it bites our bottoms.
Just look at what we found out after we bought ourselves 717s...
In all my reading I haven't run across a "we'd been fine either way if the pilots had said no. We could've lived just fine without the 717s and large regional jets and instead just kept our large fleet of 50-seaters." Or "Our only regret is we didn't get to purchase Dash 8-400s."
All I see is we wanted out of 50 seat RJs really bad and we really wanted the 717s and more large RJs. We got rid of airplanes we didnt want and got ones we did want and the pilots were the key.
And yes I will beat that drum til C2015. Because while I will fly our airplanes for whatever price 50.1% of the pilot group agrees to, I do not want to do another “if you… then we will give you these airplanes to fly”.
That stuff is none of our business. And I think maybe if we get out of that business they won’t take outsourcing to the max allowed out of the fear that we won’t bail them out when outsourcing bites the bottomline as much it bites our bottoms.
Just look at what we found out after we bought ourselves 717s...
2012 Q2 Earnings Call:
RA: The first investment we are making is to restructure our domestic fleet by eliminating a substantial portion of our 50-seat regional jet fleet. We’ve already completely retired our propeller fleet. We will ultimately replace 75% of our 50-seat flying with more cost-effective mainline aircraft and two-class regional jets. Our 50-seaters peaked at more than 500 in 2008 and we intend to reduce it to less than 125 aircraft over the next two years.
EB: We haven’t publicly disclosed the impact. Obviously we believe it to be substantial. If you look at the, not just the cost of continuing to keep the 50-seat RJs in the fleet but even more importantly the upcoming fairly significant maintenance costs that we’re going to be experiencing which will run into the hundreds of millions of dollars on that fleet if we had decided to retain that aircraft. So not just a savings on the current cost structure but a substantial benefit to offset future cost rises.
RA: With the benefits achieved with our new pilot agreement, we have the flexibility we need to both accelerate our fleet restructuring and improve pilot productivity as we vary our capacity by season. The agreement enables us to up-gauge our domestic fleet by acquiring 717s and two-class regional jets which will replace more than 200 50-seat aircraft over the next few years.
2012 Q3 Earnings Call:
RA: So by up-gauging the domestic with MD-90 and 717s which are really capital efficient and then the 737-900s, we’ll be able to produce the same number of seats but we’ll do it with fewer airplanes, fewer takeoffs and landings which is where the scale leverage comes from, from the fleet changes.
EB: No, because actually, we’ll be mindful of our frequency by market and that’s a key driver, and the 717 deal, particularly, gives us much better gauge and the second thing is, I don’t think customers want to fly 800, 900 miles on a 50-seater. Part of what we’re doing here is putting a better product in the market, better fuel efficiency, fewer airplanes in the air and our customers tell us they much prefer flying on mainline airplanes rather than 34-, 44-, and 50-seat airplanes.
EB: So we will look at all alternatives in terms of which balance sheet they end up on, the regional partner on Delta but when you think about it from a total liability perspective, what our goal is, is to take out the debt and significant costs that are part of owning all these 50-seaters.
RA: The first investment we are making is to restructure our domestic fleet by eliminating a substantial portion of our 50-seat regional jet fleet. We’ve already completely retired our propeller fleet. We will ultimately replace 75% of our 50-seat flying with more cost-effective mainline aircraft and two-class regional jets. Our 50-seaters peaked at more than 500 in 2008 and we intend to reduce it to less than 125 aircraft over the next two years.
EB: We haven’t publicly disclosed the impact. Obviously we believe it to be substantial. If you look at the, not just the cost of continuing to keep the 50-seat RJs in the fleet but even more importantly the upcoming fairly significant maintenance costs that we’re going to be experiencing which will run into the hundreds of millions of dollars on that fleet if we had decided to retain that aircraft. So not just a savings on the current cost structure but a substantial benefit to offset future cost rises.
RA: With the benefits achieved with our new pilot agreement, we have the flexibility we need to both accelerate our fleet restructuring and improve pilot productivity as we vary our capacity by season. The agreement enables us to up-gauge our domestic fleet by acquiring 717s and two-class regional jets which will replace more than 200 50-seat aircraft over the next few years.
2012 Q3 Earnings Call:
RA: So by up-gauging the domestic with MD-90 and 717s which are really capital efficient and then the 737-900s, we’ll be able to produce the same number of seats but we’ll do it with fewer airplanes, fewer takeoffs and landings which is where the scale leverage comes from, from the fleet changes.
EB: No, because actually, we’ll be mindful of our frequency by market and that’s a key driver, and the 717 deal, particularly, gives us much better gauge and the second thing is, I don’t think customers want to fly 800, 900 miles on a 50-seater. Part of what we’re doing here is putting a better product in the market, better fuel efficiency, fewer airplanes in the air and our customers tell us they much prefer flying on mainline airplanes rather than 34-, 44-, and 50-seat airplanes.
EB: So we will look at all alternatives in terms of which balance sheet they end up on, the regional partner on Delta but when you think about it from a total liability perspective, what our goal is, is to take out the debt and significant costs that are part of owning all these 50-seaters.
In all my reading I haven't run across a "we'd been fine either way if the pilots had said no. We could've lived just fine without the 717s and large regional jets and instead just kept our large fleet of 50-seaters." Or "Our only regret is we didn't get to purchase Dash 8-400s."
All I see is we wanted out of 50 seat RJs really bad and we really wanted the 717s and more large RJs. We got rid of airplanes we didnt want and got ones we did want and the pilots were the key.
Last edited by forgot to bid; 06-04-2013 at 05:52 PM.
06-04-2013 | 06:03 PM
Straight QOL, homie
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From: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Absolutely.
And we don't chip in for gas, either.
And let's pledge not to talk ourselves into absorbing whatever new crisis the company and ALPA manufacture to help them manipulate our crippling risk aversity.
And for crying out loud, let's educate the low-information ALPA-trusting voters to make sure they accomplish some due diligence next time around. No more following ALPA's powerpoint rangers off the cliff.
And we don't chip in for gas, either.
And let's pledge not to talk ourselves into absorbing whatever new crisis the company and ALPA manufacture to help them manipulate our crippling risk aversity.
And for crying out loud, let's educate the low-information ALPA-trusting voters to make sure they accomplish some due diligence next time around. No more following ALPA's powerpoint rangers off the cliff.
Last edited by Purple Drank; 06-04-2013 at 06:16 PM.
06-04-2013 | 06:09 PM
Da Hudge
Joined: Oct 2006
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From: Poodle Whisperer
Just catching up here, but the "getting the 7ER thing out of seniority" discussion... I've got to comment there.
At my peak, I was ~360 out of ~420 on the ATL767. That's a lot of people behind me, and I held a line several months out of the year typically. That's hardly out of seniority.
Had I bid to the NYC 7ER, I would have peaked at ~65% in category. Is almost half way up in category holding it out of seniority? I could have held my choice of various nice trips as a very solid lineholder, though mostly on the weekends... including CPT, AMM, CAI, the occasional PRG, VCE, south america, and various others.
What happened? Well we merged (nothing against the NW guys), and we've reduced service or just don't serve at all piles of those cities. NYC was an all international category up through around 2009. We outsourced many of those cities completely to AF/KL.
I'd still be a lineholder on the NYC7ER, albeit down to around 75% in category-- doing mostly domestic flying. Guess what I used to do a lot on the ATL767? Yep... NYC 757 domestic and local international legs.
Was anyone holding the 7ER out of seniority? Nope. Was getting that senior on a widebody category not the historical norm at DL? Yep, but that doesn't make it out of seniority. Why aren't we holding it anymore? Well... we don't fly to those cities anymore, the airline has been synergized (I'm sure FTB can dig up how many people were on the 767+7ER in later 2008 vs. now), and we've realigned to smaller gauge flying.
Oh, and whoever said that the FAA said to stop putting newhires on the ER, that never happened.
At my peak, I was ~360 out of ~420 on the ATL767. That's a lot of people behind me, and I held a line several months out of the year typically. That's hardly out of seniority.
Had I bid to the NYC 7ER, I would have peaked at ~65% in category. Is almost half way up in category holding it out of seniority? I could have held my choice of various nice trips as a very solid lineholder, though mostly on the weekends... including CPT, AMM, CAI, the occasional PRG, VCE, south america, and various others.
What happened? Well we merged (nothing against the NW guys), and we've reduced service or just don't serve at all piles of those cities. NYC was an all international category up through around 2009. We outsourced many of those cities completely to AF/KL.
I'd still be a lineholder on the NYC7ER, albeit down to around 75% in category-- doing mostly domestic flying. Guess what I used to do a lot on the ATL767? Yep... NYC 757 domestic and local international legs.
Was anyone holding the 7ER out of seniority? Nope. Was getting that senior on a widebody category not the historical norm at DL? Yep, but that doesn't make it out of seniority. Why aren't we holding it anymore? Well... we don't fly to those cities anymore, the airline has been synergized (I'm sure FTB can dig up how many people were on the 767+7ER in later 2008 vs. now), and we've realigned to smaller gauge flying.
Oh, and whoever said that the FAA said to stop putting newhires on the ER, that never happened.
06-04-2013 | 06:11 PM
Gets Weekends Off
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The whole "no hiring" thing from the CR newsletter sure sounds like they've accidentally broken the code on a coming merger. Can't imagine why we'd delay hiring pilots with the retirements coming up, and staff with inefficient and costly displacements, followed by reinstatements, "We've received clarity" is more like "shut up and do what we tell you" from marketing. And despite all this, our capacity is flat, our routes are unchanged, hubs the same, it's not like there's a whole lot of crazy going on at Delta Air Lines. Make ready the boarding party!
We increased large rj scope in the last contract. I don't care what ALPA says. Everything else was smoke and mirrors and weak justifications. I still can't accept the fact that we are still giving up large rj scope.
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