Just to clear things up. No one including me is for outsourcing our jobs. Some will argue that JV's and Code shares shore up the business model to have you keep YOUR job, but do not take YOUR job away.

I think that is very near sighted. It today's world companies like these set ups. It insulates each company from all of the capital that needs to be put on the line for a similar parallel operation that competes with that airline. The JV in effect reduces capacity and in theory increases yield. That is true until the LCC's figure a way to make it across the pond.

From a pilot perspective these are very scary. I am concerned about the implications for this group. We have agreed to only 50% of the growth across the North Atlantic. Will we agree to only 50% of the growth in the Far East? Maybe, and if so that means jobs.

Like I and many have said the devil is in the details. Fact is that JAL no matter what the deal is, serves cities that DAL does not nor will ever serve. That adds access to our network. We as pilots just want to make sure we are not selling our jobs. I agree with that.

IMHO, it takes someone like SWA or us taking JAL out of the OneWorld Alliance for all airlines to realize that these JV's,and Code Shares really open a company up to others blasting large holes in their route structure. It may even make a few realize that the best way to protect yourself is to do it yourself.

Just food for thought!

For some of us though, it would have been nice to have had the stock dumped in when it at $12 a share, thereby filling up your 401k with THEIR money, then getting 11% more in your check each month...

Assuming you could have sold it in your 401k anywhere close to that price, (at this point anything over $9.21) that would give you an overall better return.(unless you are in a strange tax situation).ie; If you have the choice tomorrow, would you rather have the company stick 50k in your 401k or put 50k of your own dollars in there?

Understand completely. Fact is that it was no where near that price when we were close to selling it.
I would like DAL to dump 50K a year in to my 401K each year! :D

JAL Confirms Alliance Talks, Plans to Cut Jobs
Japanese Carrier Expects to Reach Deal by Mid-October

TOKYO -- Japan Airlines Corp. confirmed tie-up talks with foreign carriers and said it would slash its work force by 14% as the struggling carrier seeks to escape its long malaise.

Delta Air Lines Inc. and American Airlines parent AMR Corp. have been in separate talks with JAL in recent weeks to build stronger ties and potentially invest hundreds of millions of dollars in the unprofitable airline, according to people familiar with the matter.

Speaking briefly Tuesday, JAL Chief Executive Haruka Nishimatsu declined to disclose the identity of the other carriers but said he expects a mid-October deadline.....

DALLAS (TheStreet) -- As a strongly motivated AMR(AMR Quote) battles to ensure its continued partnership with Japan Air Lines, other partners in the Oneworld alliance are also considering investment in JAL.

Both British Airways and the Australian carrier Qantas are potential investors, said a person who is familiar with the negotiations between AMR's American Airlines and JAL.

In particular, British Airways is "deeply preoccupied" that JAL could partner with the SkyTeam alliance, which includes its rival AirFrance as well as Delta(DAL Quote), the person said, noting, "All of the members of Oneworld, led by American, are profoundly interested in intensifying the relationship with JAL.

"American is extraordinarily motivated to maintain a successful partnership with JAL that is more than 10 years old, to keep them in Oneworld and to move forward with more intensive joint operations," the person said. "American will always make an offer superior to whatever Delta wants to do." A British Airways spokeswoman declined to comment and a Qantas spokesperson was not immediately available.

Financially troubled JAL is seeking to restructure and to raise funding from banks, investment funds and others including airlines. It wants about $300 million to $500 million from an airline partner or partners, as a share of the $2.7 billion it reportedly needs. The airline investment is viewed as an industry vote of confidence that would inspire other investors to participate.

JAL has the largest hub at Tokyo Narita, Asia's key airport because of its importance to Japan and its web of connections throughout the continent.

Currently, American and JAL are not only Oneworld partners, but also have a frequent flier partnership and a code-share that enables them to write tickets on one another's flights. In 2007, American moved into a JAL terminal at Narita, providing a key method to carry its passengers beyond Tokyo to points in Asia.


Various media outlets in the U.S. and Japan have reported that Delta is bidding for JAL, potentially in concert with partner AirFrance/KLM. Delta already operates a hub at Narita, which it obtained as part of its 2008 merger with Northwest, which was awarded rights to fly beyond Tokyo into Asia in 1947. Delta serves Narita from seven cities in North America, Honolulu and 14 cities in Asia.

American believes its relationship with JAL is too valuable to give up. Additionally, it is American's contention that were JAL to ally with Delta, it would become a "junior partner."

Delta/Northwest has a 60-year-old Narita operation and currently competes with JAL on a variety of routes throughout Asia. By contrast, all of American's passengers beyond Narita are turned over to JAL. The two carriers also share a terminal.

Talks regarding JAL are proceeding rapidly. JAL said Tuesday it wants to have financing in place by October. The CEOs of Delta, Air France and KLM are scheduled to meet in Paris Wednesday to discuss the topic, the person said. A Delta spokeswoman declined to comment. An AMR team, which does not include CEO Gerard Arpey, has been meeting with JAL officials since last week.
Ongoing Open Skies negotiations between the U.S. and Japan play a role in JAL's strategy. If the bilateral aviation treaty between the two countries is indeed liberalized, United(UAUA Quote) and its Star Alliance partner, Japanese carrier ANA, are expected to seek antitrust immunity that would enable them to freely discuss pricing and scheduling on trans-Pacific routes.

American and JAL agreed in June to pursue a similar strategy, but now the identity of JAL's U.S. partner is not quite as clear

A Tip of the Hat to whoever posts the most convoluted bankruptcy furloughed, merged, military leave, worked, made Captain, bankruptcy II, retired, contract, expat, expat Captain, furloughed, re-hired scenario to this board.

I know these guys are out there. You meet some on DL 55 and 56 doing their commute.

That must be directed at the AMR guys, since I do not know anybody from DAL that is under contract over at JALways. I am sure AMR might have a few. :D

Agreed. I think it was early Feb when it 12+ and Athena, under direction of Lee Moak, still had it in his hands.. Only about 30 days later it was at a 52 week low and they decided to dump it into our accounts...

My point is that it should have been turned over to us in the first place, and if not, then I would have preferred for it to be placed in our accounts at higher, not lower price...

Just heard Yamaha bought Japan Air Lines:

How long did that take you to write up? It is quite entertaining! :p