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Originally Posted by acl65pilot
(Post 710230)
It it bugged me, I have not business in the business of representing our pilots. I really do not care who gets credit for the successes or the idea. I just want the ideas to result in success. It is not about the originator, just the idea.
Yes, but the idea needs to be followed up with by the right vote. Do you know how the Reps we just voted in would have voted on Compass recommendation? Hansen - divest, but at least he carefully listened to and was complimentary to our reasoning. Still, I think he would have voted to divest. Am I wrong? Craig - ?? Gomez - ?? Deitz - divest, based on the "conflict of interest" I still think we face a real possibility of scope lines being drawn around type certificates. It makes more sense to management and the FAA (ie the rest of the industry) to fly a E195 at Compass rather than mainline. We already see once regional airlines taking over national operations and it is only a matter of time before these guys push beyond Canada and Mexico. By washing our hands of Compass, we've lost operational control of the most capable outsourced jets on the property. I don't think we would agree to outsource 100 to 130 seaters, but I'm not at all positive we would not. If some sort of retirement restoration were to be dangled in front of the MEC then you and I could be amongst the last generation of Delta pilots. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 710231)
I am not sure where the 1700 number came from. It is not however a correct number for Delta. The ALPA proposal which will not be the final rule more then likely would require a modest increase in pilot manning at Delta. Somewhere in the area of 200 to 300 pilots. If it is watered down which is likely under the intense pressure from the ATA then the increase will be less. The Delta contract already requires much of what the new rule requires. The driving factors for pilot jobs at Delta are simple. How many total pilot block hours does the company have to man and what percentage of that ends up being credit time. Required Block hours plus credit time equals jobs. Even with the thousands of jobs we gave up via SCOPE, work rules and elimination of the cap the new ruling wont cause a big job boost at Delta. It may cause domestic pilots to work more days to get the same number of hours but it wont increase the number of pilots. Contractual changes in the next contract such as restoring vacation to pay and credit could make a huge difference but that is several years away at best.
The new work rules might economically level the playing field and make it less attractive to outsource jobs. |
Originally Posted by finis72
(Post 710229)
Shiznet, I agree with no more giving but you are comparing a different industry.Dl makes/looses money flying pax,FDX and UPS make money consistently flying boxes.Flame away but if it goes to arbitration we will not be able to point to the cargo outfits,only other airlines.
I didn't think there was anything that forced us to go to arbitration during contract negotiations. In fact, I thought we always rejected binding arbitration and let it go to a cooling off period. So, I don't think we have to worry about proving anything to an arbitrator. Right? Seriously, I'm asking. It's been 11 years since I've ben thru a real contract negotiation. New K Now |
I was asked by a lot of senior guys if I was willing to restore a DB plan. My response what hell no!
Next question was why? It is lengthy but the short answer is this: It would not give previous credit for service, and would be a day one type of deal. Even if it did, they would make guys work to 65 and the payout tables would be vastly different It could be taken away again!!!!!!!!!!!!! It saves the company money in the long term as you would not live as long, duh! I am all for allowing the guys that are allowed to "catch up" based on the governments definition to have their 401K's maxed out by company match. it is the best solution and it is their money the second it is put in there. There are going to be guys that think they got hosed with the pay out and they did, but trying to right that wrong with a DB plan is just dumb. The phrase of "Screw me once shame on you, screw me twice shame on me." comes to mind. I would hope that no one would be that dumb!!!! As for what carrot, well there are plenty of guys that would give it away for money. What needs to be done is make people see history for what it is. As for who would have voted for what, I would love to get in to that debate but as you have stated that boat has said, and in fact has already docked at another port and off loaded its cargo. It is my goal to make sure the new reps maintain a very close relationship with the CPS guys. It is the logical choice for the 195 to go to DCI for a period of five years with some caveat that we would get the C_Series, but as we know if we gave them the jet we will eventually give them the seats too! It has to be here. I sleep well at night knowing that Mondo, Craig, Hanson, and Diest get that. They are also aware that any "deal" of that nature will probably awaken the silent majority and ALPA would be off property very quickly. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 710231)
It may cause domestic pilots to work more days to get the same number of hours but it wont increase the number of pilots.
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Originally Posted by reddog25
(Post 710029)
Yes doable....they also get over $250/hr and have a DC retirement......apples and oranges. Been doing this now for 22 years now; what do you want to give up?
Time for a little Carlton Heston: "You can take it from my cold dead hands" |
Originally Posted by newKnow
(Post 710239)
finis,
I didn't think there was anything that forced us to go to arbitration during contract negotiations. In fact, I thought we always rejected binding arbitration and let it go to a cooling off period. So, I don't think we have to worry about proving anything to an arbitrator. Right? Seriously, I'm asking. It's been 11 years since I've ben thru a real contract negotiation. New K Now It's been 9 years for us Deltoids and it was a sweet contract while it lasted,I will never make what I made back then. |
ACL,
Why would they make guys work to 65? Is there anything in the new law that requires that? Or, could we negotiate out of that? New K Now |
Originally Posted by finis72
(Post 710247)
New, I was just trying to point out we are a different group of the transportation industry. Until there is a credible ability to strike I don't see arbitration in our future, too much to lose if in the hands of a 3rd party.
It's been 9 years for us Deltoids and it was a sweet contract while it lasted,I will never make what I made back then. |
Originally Posted by finis72
(Post 710247)
New, I was just trying to point out we are a different group of the transportation industry. Until there is a credible ability to strike I don't see arbitration in our future, too much to lose if in the hands of a 3rd party.
It's been 9 years for us Deltoids and it was a sweet contract while it lasted,I will never make what I made back then. I wonder what's going on at American? :rolleyes: |
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