You're not talking to brick walls, you're talking with people who simply disagree. I really wish they'd plug our "desired" min day into Carmen and spit out a bid packet for each category to see how many would like them...I'm guessing many would not. The problem with packing that much flying into a trip is that we need the extra days off to recover, especially as we age. In my current category we have 3-days worth 26+12...9 days gone and you're done. Sounds great, until you realize you're body is wrecked and you need the day after to recover, so it might as well be 12 days of flying. Of course if you're a commuter this may be desirable, except that this trip has a early sign-in so you're coming in the day prior anyway.

When I first got on the 73N, we had a packet full of 4 leg, 4 day trips. Nice long layovers in good spots with a few hours of credit. I even flew a 3 leg, 4 day. But my absolute favorite trip was a 2 leg, 2 day, SAN or PHX overnight with a 18 hour layover. Hands down, the most lesiurely trip I've ever had. If they hadn't gotten rid of them, I'd probably still be on the 73N. But alas, the optimizer got fired up and they started tagging DCA/BWI turns on either end of the trip which made it a long freaking day and gave no time to enjoy the overnight. The 4 leg, 4 days all but dried up and the trips started flying A LOT more block, with a crap ton of < 15 hour layovers, which were not desirable to me.

I just opened up the 73N/320/7ER bid packets for my base...yuck. I say yes, they could use some more long layovers. Way too many 3 leg days with < 16 hour layovers. I sure hope we don't pass anything that entices them to pack even more flying into those trips. I'd like to bid back down to NB Captain some day, but not with the crappy trips we have right now.

 

Agreed. If I wanted to be worked to death and enjoy 10hr layovers at the airport Holiday Inn I would have stayed at the regionals.

 

The optimizer is probably the worse thing to happen to our qol since making the summer months 30 day bid periods. My qol is at an all-time low at this company and I'm in the top 20 percent of my category. I've started working a Saturday or Sunday here or there because the weekday trips are so bad.

 

They have had the optimizer for at least 10 years.

 

Honest question....So then what has changed to make trip quality/construction so poor on the narrowbody fleets? This is as bad as its has ever been. And it started long before the summer redline program.

 

Think of it like this: an optimized run is done with absolute minimum cost/credit. Then planners use a credit “budget” allocated by their managers, to improve the bid package for pilot preference. Those “budgets” have been dramatically cut in the last 24 months or so.

Side effect of that: the PWA provision that requires the first legal deadhead forces messed up redeye+deadhead trips when credit can’t be spent to avoid them. This stuff needs to be fixed at the contract level

 

Just read this months planning/staffing newsletter. They are actively looking to drive credit as low as possible in the name of profit and productivity. Time to put to teeth in our contract and take back our QOL from the 4th floor!

 

Agreed. Im actually amazed that many of these trips pass FAR 117 legality. Ya know, the rule enacted to mitigate fatigue. How about 5 days that start with redeyes, 11 hrs rest to fly out same night followed by the last 2 days with early reports and a last day with 3 legs 8 hrs+flying. Completely fatiguing and unacceptable. Something needs to change fast before an incident occurs.

 

They talk out of both sides of their mouth. Depends on their audience.

 

Okay but they just turned it on recently.