You coudn't be more incorrect.

The instructor in me has to come out here for a moment. :D The intention is to always plan on 5 minutes. Engineering would prefer it to be in the single digits of percent that we actually apply takeoff power less than 5 minutes.

The 3 minutes is only supposed to be a "holy crap we got bumped up in line" thing.

edit: This applies to the 757/767 only.

Waves,

Perhaps you should think of it this way. During SLI negotiations, what was the job of the NWA NC? To get the best integration possible for the NWA pilots. What was the job of the Delta NC? The exact same thing. The Super Premium WB thing was kind of tacky IMO, but the 744 does hold 400+ pax to the 777's 280ish pax. By historical standard the more pax, the more $$$.

Please understand I'm not talking down to you, as I know you've been doing this longer then I have.:o I'm just trying to present what I think was most likely the mentality/approach of the NWA NC. What you were reading in the arbitration records was not a condescending superiority, but each NC doing their respective jobs.....presenting what they felt was necessary to get the best results for their pilot group.

In regards to our staffing, we have multiple fleets that are burning through reserves everyday. This includes WB fleets, and IA's and GS trips are going out everyweek. This is during what is typically considered the slowest season of airline travel, so what will happen this summer as NB block hours are increased 5.7%? We have 16 more MD90's coming, and 30ish DC9's being parked so not really a huge net loss. There is possibly more MD90's coming, so it may not be a net loss at all. Also, most likely more 767's will be coming out of storage this summer, and the IATA reports that international travel is improving. We have 76 seat scope locked down, and the economy is improving. 50 seaters are being parked. We just merged in one of the worst(if not the worst) economic downturns in the history of the world. Our Age 65 retirements start to pour on in 2017, and don't stop for 15+ years. How many of those will make it to 65?
I could keep going, but I think I gave you many reasons to brighten your outlook for our future. ;)

Welcome to APC, and Cheers

I'm dating myself here, but the minimum for the 727 was only two minutes. As a 727 Captain, I always preferred starting them sooner, but the company sure didn't like that idea.

Yeah I should have specified it's for the 75/76 only. :)

I've heard a lot of stories of SO's just getting the second engine online on the 727 as they were applying takeoff power!

Yep, time to join together and get what we all deserve in 2012!

Excellent post as always, johnso. :)

As several have pointed out to me as a new guy here, I have apparently unintentionally dredged up the unwelcome past. I have tried to abandon this subject, but I keep getting hit with replies.

I will agree with you what the MEC and NC jobs were, but it was the way it was handled by the NW MEC and NC which I beleive was partially dishonest, misleading, and deplorable. Without writting a book here and dredging up more ugliness, I will leave it at that. Or at least try to. I can elaborate, but I prefer not to. The bottom line is that the final SLI was for the most part a fair and balanced agreement of which I think we can all live with.

My veiw point about our fleet should not necessarily be misconstrued as pessimism. Although we now have a NWA's CEO, in the past DAL has always been very conservative regarding buying aircraft or expanding service. Sometimes this has proved to be a good decision, and sometimes not so good. The fact is, DAL has nearly always been the last one on the block to upgrade the fleet or expand. Contrarily, DAL has been a leader in buying regionals and outsourcing jobs to regionals. So forgive me if I seem pessimistic.

Additionally, please don't ever be lulled into thinking we have the 76 seat issue "locked down." Review our scope of 20 years past and you will see we have anything but a lock on this issue. We have been giving away bits and pieces of our scope clause for year after year. Did you know that ASA at one time planned on buying 737's? I know this to be fact, because I knew the ASA Chief Pilot at the time. Did you know that ASA also flew 88 seat connection aircraft for DAL, but they were painted white instead of connection colors? The only reason the 50 seaters are going away is because they are extremely inefficient, passengers hate them, and they are rapidly being replaced with larger jets. I too could go on, my friend. I appreciate your optimissim, eagerness, and friendlness, and I hope I don't come across as the grouchy old Captain, but I probably have.

This is very true, of course it never happened to me. LOL OK, maybe it did, but you can't prove it. LOL The 3 minute rule sprouted up after having too many cracked turbine blades on the 757 P&W's . When I flew the 757/767, I beleive it was 2 minutes as well.

Holy cow. I'm at 81 and part of that is because of recurrent and they still wouldn't give me short call the other day so I went 4 days without flying and I'm about 8-10 numbers down in my bucket to be called.

I think its fair to say the A320 is understaffed? Are we seeing that "hope" that we all had that because of Delta's work rules that the DALN side would be understaffed and that'd be good for us as the 30/40s started to leave the system. Hopefully the 30/40s don't disappear, 30/40s = Delta jobs and Delta new hire jobs.

If we had a new hire class on Monday and we had a class drop, I wonder what it'd be.

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Tsquare, sorry about your vols. :(