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-   -   Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/36912-any-latest-greatest-about-delta.html)

LeineLodge 04-05-2010 12:16 PM


Originally Posted by Scoop (Post 790184)
Read it yourself Fellas. Here is a sample of COMAIR's treatment of DAL Pilots. The icing on the cake was that as soon as DAL started recalling/hiring COMAIR changed this policy - what a joke.

Scoop




TO: Comair Pilots
FROM: J.C. Lawson, Comair MEC Chairman DATE:December 16, 2002
Your MEC met in CVG with the Delta MEC Chairman, Captain Will Buergey, at his request, to discuss preferential hiring of furloughed Delta pilots at Comair. Through this letter, I hope to dispel rumors and provide a more thorough understanding of the purpose and outcome of that meeting.

The Delta MEC, while in session at the bi-annual October Board of Directors meeting in Hollywood, Florida, formally directed the Delta MEC Chairman via resolution to meet with the Comair MEC Chairman to seek preferential hiring for furloughed Delta pilots at Comair while allowing them to retain their Delta seniority.

The general philosophy held by the Comair MEC is:

We are sensitive to the regrettable plight of all furloughed pilots in our industry.
We encourage our management to hire pilots who seek a future at Comair.
We have formally approached Comair management and our management has agreed to preferential hiring of furloughed ALPA pilots.
We agree with our company's policy that requires prospective Comair pilots to resign their seniority at their previous carrier. We believe our Company's industry-standard policy requiring seniority resignation is sound and wise. It promotes the general health and welfare of all Comair employees and serves to protect the future of our company.
At our meeting in CVG, Captain Buergey offered preferential hiring to Comair pilots if the Comair MEC would recommend to Comair management that they hire furloughed Delta pilots and allow them to retain their Delta seniority.
Your MEC responded that hiring any pilots at Comair who do not resign their seniority at their previous carrier gives rise to numerous substantive concerns. The Delta MEC's offer of (future) preferential hiring at Delta is not sufficiently substantive to overcome those concerns and solicit Comair pilots' support. We suggested three alternative concepts, any one or all of which might lead to a mutually beneficial solution:

Relax the Delta PWA, Section 1, seat restrictions imposed upon Comair and ASA that limit our growth in 70-seat and larger airframes.
Negotiate Delta Brand Scope language with Delta management that defines all Delta flying within the Delta revenue stream to be performed solely by Delta, Comair, and ASA pilots.
Negotiate a plan for future integration of our Delta, Comair, and ASA pilots seniority lists that fairly recognizes the efforts and contributions of all.

The Comair MEC stands ready to work with the collective MEC's to bring about change that makes sense in a challenging economic environment and works for all pilots who perform flying under the Delta brand. As we stated in the Tuesday, December 3rd meeting, our door is still open.

COMAIR MEC
AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION, INTERNATIONAL
SUITE 120 3940 OLYMPIC BOULEVARD ERLANGER, KY 41018
859-282-9016 FAX 859-283-5533



Sweet Jesus. They asked for relaxed scope that was limiting their growth???

Any regional pilot group needs to be VERY wary of lifers on their MEC. I'd be willing to bet the majority of comair pilots would rather get a job at Delta someday than "grow" at comair. Sucks that they'll forever be linked with this DBag that was obviously trying for a power play and kicking DAL pilots while they were down.

I'd always heard about this but never read it for myself. Yet another illustration of the conflict of interest that exists within ALPA. Generally what's good for Comair/ASA/etc is not a win for Delta pilots and vice versa. Unless, of course we tighten up the scope and can eventually bring them on here - provided they are not so damn short-sighted and will agree to go to the bottom of the list.

I just re-read it again and am getting more and more ****ed at this lifer loser. He had a choice, and has subsequently hurt those Comair pilots that came behind him.

BTW, how much influence does/did DALPA have regarding hiring candidates? Does mgmt even accept our input regarding issues such as these? Maybe this would be a case to set an example for the industry and take the high road if/when we start hiring again - excluding of course, this clown and all known co-conspirators (and yes I'd interpret co-conspirator to include those that were at comair at the time and did nothing against this.) :mad:

Weed 04-05-2010 12:17 PM

Next AE?
 
Any Guesses on the next AE? Rumors?

KC10 FATboy 04-05-2010 12:20 PM

If you need a particular day off, you should call the OE scheduling folks and request a day off. When I went through indoc, they asked us if we had any conflicts and they worked around it. They should be willing to work with you provided they haven't built a schedule for you and changing it requires significant rescheduling of others. I'd call them as soon as you can. It doesn't hurt to ask the question. Beg for forgiveness late.

KC10 FATboy 04-05-2010 12:23 PM


Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 790183)
Whether they are directly related or not, Comair is paying dearly for their past actions. I've been told it will continue.

When I went through indoc, there were roughly 60 new hires in the class. Of those new hires, there maybe was one (if that) ComAir folks in my class. ASA made up the majority of our commuter folks.

nwaf16dude 04-05-2010 12:24 PM


Originally Posted by PropNWA (Post 790227)
Anyone finish initial training on the MD88 recently that knows how many days you're typically off before starting OE? Is it backed up at all or are you out on a trip within a few days of your checkride? I need a particular day off about a week after finishing in the sim and I'm just wondering what my chances are for having it off. Thanks for any insight anyone can provide.

I'm not on the 88, but I just got the call for my first OE trip...starts one day short of a month after I finished 7576 school, which would have been great if I had known I was going to have a month off. When I finished school all I got was "we'll call you when we have something." I called them after about two weeks and got the same line. I get the feeling things are getting backed up pretty bad (or good, depending on how you look at it.)

DAL4EVER 04-05-2010 12:28 PM


Originally Posted by Superdad (Post 790198)
In reference to the comair thing:

I don't understand why DAL management accepts resignation letters from furloughed guys. To me it seems like management is saying "we don't need you right now, but we don't want you flying anywhere else while your out of a job." I always admired AA's position on this issue, telling their furloughees not to worry because they will simply throw a resignation from a furloughee in the trash.

Am I wrong?

UAL did that as well. They would accept the letter but not process it. When recalls began they would call you to double check if you intended to resign. DAL's policy was reinforced by Kolshak saying that if any Delta pilot wanted to resign it would be accepted. I never knew why we did that. For many it was the difference between finding a flying job or doing a desk job. I hope that God forbid we ever furlough again we change our policy regarding that.

johnso29 04-05-2010 12:28 PM


Originally Posted by Weed (Post 790235)
Any Guesses on the next AE? Rumors?


Union says May.

Weed 04-05-2010 12:31 PM

Next AE?
 

Originally Posted by johnso29 (Post 790248)
Union says May.

Thanks,
I'll keep my finger crossed

sailingfun 04-05-2010 12:32 PM


Originally Posted by LeineLodge (Post 790233)
Sweet Jesus. They asked for relaxed scope that was limiting their growth???

Any regional pilot group needs to be VERY wary of lifers on their MEC. I'd be willing to bet the majority of comair pilots would rather get a job at Delta someday than "grow" at comair. Sucks that they'll forever be linked with this DBag that was obviously trying for a power play and kicking DAL pilots while they were down.

I'd always heard about this but never read it for myself. Yet another illustration of the conflict of interest that exists within ALPA. Generally what's good for Comair/ASA/etc is not a win for Delta pilots and vice versa. Unless, of course we tighten up the scope and can eventually bring them on here - provided they are not so damn short-sighted and will agree to go to the bottom of the list.

I just re-read it again and am getting more and more ****ed at this lifer loser. He had a choice, and has subsequently hurt those Comair pilots that came behind him.

BTW, how much influence does/did DALPA have regarding hiring candidates? Does mgmt even accept our input regarding issues such as these? Maybe this would be a case to set an example for the industry and take the high road if/when we start hiring again - excluding of course, this clown and all known co-conspirators (and yes I'd interpret co-conspirator to include those that were at comair at the time and did nothing against this.) :mad:


They are that short sited. Right after Delta completed the purchase of Comair and ASA there was a push on within the Delta MEC to attempt to get the company to merge the seniority lists. They held a meeting with Comair and ASA to discuss trying to establish a method to work on this goal. The meeting did not go well and the concept died at Delta. Lawson and another individual who's name I forget made it quite clear what their DEMANDS were. The only exceptable solution for them was that we push for a immediate merger of the lists and it be done by ALPA merger policy and they let it be known that they viewed that as DOH and that was what they would be asking for. No prenuptial agreement would be considered by them other then DOH. That was the end of support from the Delta MEC.

I wonder sometimes if Comair pilots really understand how much damage Lawson and his side kick did to them. I know pilots involved in hiring at several major airlines. Two would be at the top of every pilots list to work for. They all knew what happened at Comair and Comair pilots went into any interview with almost any major airline with a hill to climb others did not have. Sure some got hired but that had to be well above the other applicants.

Bucking Bar 04-05-2010 12:41 PM


Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 790156)
I have always wondered why they did that.

They did it because ALPA stated the Comair MEC could not get its' own scope that bound Delta to the allocation of RJ flying. The Comair MEC correctly foresaw the whipsaw that would result in the majority of the flying Comair had traditionally performed being outsourced to non union and non ALPA members.

Lawson tried to get the Delta pilots to negotiate with him. He would gladly help change Comair Management's policy if the Delta MEC would help change ALPA's policy towards scope that shut out the Comair pilots. In my opinion it was wrong to use furloughed pilots as bargaining chips but consider:
  • The Delta MEC could have simply negotiated with Delta management who owned and controlled Comair.
  • The Delta MEC could have helped Comair secure its flying and keep more flying inside ALPA (rather than Teamsters and SkyWest)
  • The Comair pilots' nightmare scenario really came true. Their projections were correct.

As far as Comair getting hired at Delta, we had three in my class. None worked at Comair during the strike. It is my impression that management has not forgot the $330,000.00 each striking Comair pilot cost the Company (just my impression).


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