Originally Posted by Xray678

Didn't know that. But, wholly owned or not, if Delta owns the airplane, the Delta pilots should have flow down rights....to 100% of the seats. If the carrier who gets the flying doesn't like it, then you don't get the flying.

Originally Posted by Barracuda

The best no furlough protection would be an expensive one. How about every DAL pilot furloughed will keep his/her medical paid by the company, and his/her retirement contribution while on mandatory furlough. What an idea!!, force management to think whether it's worth to furlough or not?

Originally Posted by acl65pilot

And it appears that RJDC already has guidance that these LOA's will not apply to OH and EV. Those are seat you think we should have but our settlement a few years ago with RJDC and a MOA negate those as being ours.

Originally Posted by RockyBoy

I think that 1.95% dues from 12,000 pilots is enough funding to have a union of our own that will protect our jobs.

Originally Posted by Xray678

In the case of these extra RJs, Moak should have said you can have them, but Delta pilots have flow down rights to those jets in the event of a furlough. That should have been the deal with all the 76 seat RJs.

Originally Posted by Barracuda

I really don't know the details but, if these positions did not include a cpt seat or some kind of pay protection, they would probably be useless for about 90% of the furlough guys. I am not sure how a grown man with a family can support his family making upper teens or lower twenties the first year, and low to mid 30s second year. Not flame, just stating the fact that regional pay @ starting levels is too low. I was there and I know it; I also know I was single, paying rent, with no responsabilities. Today married, mortgage, and kids I could not take that job, waiting tables will make you upper 20s right away.

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar

ACL65:

We've all spent a lot of time thinking about this situation this week.

You are correct. The settlement will function as a one way check valve installed backwards! As our messy scope language gets tested the likely result is gray areas will be resolved in favor of the RJDC litigants. (dare I say, ALPA was outsmarted?) We can't fix this language until Section six (we wasted the JPWA opportunity). That is years from now.

This situation emphasizes the need to fix scope by bringing flying on board (inclusive) rather than trying to exclude and limit it. We really need to get going on this Compass resolution.

It does not benefit us to encourage the Delta MEC to act "illegally." It is exactly how they got themselves wedged in the mess they are in now. At its core logic, Delta's MEC refuses to admit it has a problem with scope. The RJDC realized Delta's position put the Delta MEC defending a Section 1 that wasn't rational, so by instituting a external review process they could strike at its least logical features one by one. (they used their enemy's arrogance as leverage)

The first step will be to get ALPA's leadership to even admit there is a problem. Right now if you ask our Reps they will tell you we have a great contract and great section 1. We need our leadership to admit the problems before we can set a course for fixing them.

Then, as we fix them, we have to include the other parties represented by ALPA. That's the law and the agreement ALPA made. The alternative is decertify and leave our Major Contingency Fund treasure literally on an island in the Caribbean. We both know decertification is highly unlikely and it is even more remote that the radicals that would then be in power would have a clue about how to fix this.

We have some really good and smart folks in DALPA. The inclusion of the NWA pilots helps get our AHRS realigned in a more unionist direction (I really like these guys). I'd rather fix our Section 1 than destroy our MEC.

As we think about alternatives, what works? Your thoughts, Sir?

Originally Posted by RockyBoy

We first need to get some reps who have a clue as to what is going on. I know that I know more about these LOA's than my reps do by the conversations I've had so far. my reps don't care about scope. Section 1 is so far down their list of priorities it is sick. I also flew with a captain this week who didn't even know that DCI was operating 76 seat jets. The only guys who even care about this issue are those who were hired after 1999.

I know that a de-certification is unlikely to happen, but this issue will not be fixed with what we now have. If nothing changes, we will have 255 90 seat jets flying at DCI carriers in less than 10 years. That is almost 3000 Delta pilot jobs given away by ALPA. We will have more DCI pilots represented by ALPA than we will mainline pilots.