Airline Pilot Central Forums - Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

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- - Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/36912-any-latest-greatest-about-delta.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 987132)

Talk to your reps, or bring a resolution forward.

A resolution would require that they approve the idea of them having to pay for their own booze when at these meetings. I think I would have a better chance with a resolution to bring all DCI pilots onto our seniority list.

Quote:

Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 987139)

I do not know how that info was broken out, but when I have been there under official business, I have opted to go out with the reps for dinner so that I can get something well below the daily meal allowance. I generally came in at about 22 a meal plus tip. It is more or less what I saw. No crazy Steak and lobster dinners, no 100 dollar bottles of wine. None of that. These guys are very good. I mean that. Even I was impressed.

For lunch it is generally catered in so that the association's business can continue though lunch uninterrupted. (Pack more crap it) Those are done by the hotels and as you know most of those will be 20-40 per plate, but a serving fee. Breakfast is served there and is buffet style. Nothing fantasy by any account. Oatmeal, fresh fruit, eggs, bacon, and the like for breakfast. Lunch is a protein, iced tea, salad and a soup. Again nothing mind boggling. My guess is the cost comes from doing it in house, which may cost more but it keeps the meetings shorter and less night for a hotel.

A few lunches we all went out in groups, those we paid for. I know I did not expense those. Rooms are direct billed to the association, charges are yours and a credit card is kept on file. No free spending. King keeps a very close tab on all of that. He is the King of "No." Just ask around.

So let me get this straight - they collect the dues from the DALPA members (who mostly get about $50/day in Per Diem) and go out and average $175/day for food and meal expenses? Seems a tad excessive.

Overall though, I would say most of the expenses seem pretty reasonable. I'm sure these guys are working pretty long hours, continuously answering E-mails and phone calls, most of which they are probably not compensated for, and I don't begrudge them staying at nice Hotels in good locations.

I do however, have one request: Guys, before you break out the DP at the next meeting lets have something to celebrate - like an Iron Clad, Lawyer proof, Bullet proof, written in blood and surrounded by 13' of concrete Scope agreement. Hell, then I even might lay down a few Benjamin's of my own on the Bar in salute of a job well done!

Scoop :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 986957)

That is my guess too. They are also short term six year CPA's. All of the ones that have been announced since the CPS divestiture has been six year terms. No longer are they 10-20 year terms. DAL is telling us exactly when this type of jet will be leaving the fleet, and 2021 or so is the latest any of these CPA's run. Looking at the layering of these contracts, you see them layering these RJ's leaving as a new jet would be arriving. Draw your own conclusions, and keep your demands firm on scope, but look at the corporate side too. Sunsetting them is easy with this evidence, and should cost very little.

Also reread Ronnie's comments, they speak the truth of a lot of this group, that the forum poster do not want to see.

I want to wager on how many slots LCC and DAL had to divest. I am guessing five in LGA and five in DCA. Anyone think that there are airplanes involved as well?

Maybe we can say good-by to the B767-300G's.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck416 (Post 987145)

Hi ACL,
I'm not trying to beat up the ALPA volunteers. However, the appearances look pretty, unseemly. I'm sure that there are reasonable explanations, so it concerns me that the reps are not forthcoming with them.
Chuck

Not going to argue it, and I am not versed enough on what these data points from C20 entail to give you a good guess on the breakout is. There are many reasons why this data could prove "Not Meanful". For starters, how did they break the costs out? By Rep, hotel reservations, planned attendees, etc? If you show up as a line guy, you get the meals, cokes during the day, etc. No one is excluded that is a Delta pilot.

Either way, like the National data until you have a specific list of what each number entails, it truly is just a number with no baseline.

Fyp, I have no issue with stricter limits on certain items, but I also understand why these meetings are expensive after being to one the size of the Delta MEC's. It ain't no country rodeo. I mean that nicely too. I would like every pilot to go sit in one and realize the work that needs to be done and the scope of these meetings. They are a true butt kicking for those involved.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyBoy (Post 987158)

Not too sure about this. The myth is far removed from reality. Yes, there are a few here and there that drink their fair share, but most do not. Most realize that they have to be up the next morning back at the mind numbing task of sitting though another 10+ hrs of a MEC meeting, or a middle seat across country after the meeting is over.

If we are going to publish this data it needs to be meaningful. To me this just looks like a lot of numbers.

* Of note there are many events that are not meetings that have hospitality suites; for example the Professional Standards meeting, and many Flight Operations Personnel are there as well. It is necessary to have a venue like this, because frankly that is where all of the work gets done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver (Post 987102)

ACL, care to comment on that one? :eek:

How would we get votes like we do without lots of free booze and membership in an exclusive club? Open and principled debate might break out & everyone knows that's a slow way to make sausage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by acl65pilot (Post 987166)

I basically agree with you ACL. I know it costs tons of money to run these meetings and they need to be run in a way that allows all those involved to do a good job. I don't have a problem with them staying in nice places with the resources that they need to get stuff done. I give them 1.95% of my money and I basically don't care what they do with it, as long as they are doing things to protect my job and increase my quality of life. The only thing I can see that is potentially out of line with these expenses would be the amount spent for food and from past experience I think the large amount is due to the cost of alcohol. Other than that, I don't think the costs are out of line.

I still want to see the FPL numbers with a breakdown by committee and name.

I didn't ask to see meeting expenses and neither did the resolution.

King will get his chance to show those numbers at the next C20 meeting. I wonder if he will bring the FPL numbers with him in a written format.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyBoy (Post 987112)

Looks to me like they should have all the MEC meetings in ATL.....lots cheaper than NYC. They also need to break down the cost of meals to show how much they are spending on alcohol. I have a problem with my dues buying booze for MEC meetings.

I'm pretty sure that no dues money is spent on booze, unless you consider the daily expense money that the attendees get in place of DAL per diem, as dues money. Unless it has recently changed all hospitality expenses are paid out of the expense money. That includes any alcohol and food outside of lunch, which is usually a working lunch. Ask your reps how it is done.

1) If LUV has a higher cost structure than us, how do they turn a profit when we don't? (I've been told by managers at Delta that SW has a higher cost structure. Also, its well known that they pay thier people more across the board.ie_Pilots, FA, Rampers) They have lower yields per ticket in revenue, don't collect a premium on First Class seats, and miss out on big money from bags. I'd like to see a list compiled of why they make money when we don't. And not something like: They don't have RJs or our VPs are paid more or they don't have Alpa. Something based purely in financial terms.

Somewhere is published the number of employees per airplane for all airlines.
SWA was around 36 and Delta was around 79 people per aircraft.
This is a huge reason that they have a cost advantage over us.
These numbers are old and from memory.
Anybody have the latest numbers?