Originally Posted by hockeypilot44 (Post 1123041)

My friends hired at Southwest about the same time I started here are making $150,000 - $160,000 / year. I made less than $100,000 in 2011. A 50-60 percent pay raise is not going to happen. I don't think a 20 percent raise is going to happen. Actually, I really think we'll be offered something like a 30 percent raise over the life of the contract. Will I vote "no?" Of course I will. I think everyone will. I also think in 4 years, we'll be working for the same wages we are working for now. Now a 20 percent raise up front will pass. There's no doubt in my mind.

Originally Posted by iaflyer (Post 1123237)

American Airlines asks to meet with its three major unions | Airlines and Aviation | Dallas Star-Telegram

I wonder what they'll talk about? Maybe changing from Pepsi to Coke? Color of the ties? Probably minor issues like that... :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by alfaromeo (Post 1122926)

Could you give me some examples of how pilot groups are playing tackle football and succeeding.? I don't mind changing tactics, but I have to have some evidence of success so you can prove to me your theory actually works.

This is my tally. If you take CAL, UAL, AMR, and LCC for the last four years, their total pay rates have increased by 1.5%, 1.5%, 1.5%, and 0% respectively. Our pay rates (including DC) have gone up by 27.5% on average in the same time frame and we added $750 million in merger stock. I see these great theories about how the hardball tactics are great, I just need some history of success to back up those theories.

Originally Posted by Launchpad475 (Post 1123221)

The first 40-50 320's are older that crap, they are part of the -900 replacement order too is my understanding from the 320 LCA types-

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 1123098)

The two contracts were carefully compared by both committees. The average total hours paid under each contract during the 3 years prior to the merger were within .5 hours of each other with the Delta contract slightly higher. You can ask the people involved at NW for the exact numbers Carl.
Yes NW had some aspects that produced increases Delta did not have. However Delta had a bunch of aspects to their contract NW did not have. Examples include a higher reserve guarantee for NW. However that was offset by reroute pay, reserve duty period lookback, additional pay for long call trips under 12 hours, pay on top of the guarantee for GS flying ect..
NW got limited pay above 80 hours at time and a half however it was not as posted often on all flying. There was a system that for practical purposes limited the hours depending on the caps. Delta paid double pay on all GS flying. In the end when everything was added up each contract produced essentially the same pay hours per month per pilot.
The Delta 1113 contract was however much shorter duration then the NW contract with higher rates. The much shorter duration of the Delta contract was a critical item. Carl claims he made more as a NW pilot but the facts don't support his case.
Premerger the NW pay rate on the 757 as a example was 142 dollars an hour. There were some small raise built into the NW contract so the rate today would be around 148 to 150. I don't have the exact numbers. The rate in effect today with the joint contract is 189 an hour or over 25 percent higher.
Carl was getting 177 an hour at the merger as a 747 Captain. He currently with international pay is getting 231.75 an hour. He is also getting a additional 1 percent a hour into retirement which will jump to 14 percent in 11 months or an additional 32 dollars an hour if Carl was a 0 percenter in the NW matrix. That would bring his total raise on 1 Jan 13 to 87 dollars an hour. With the raises in the NW contract he will still be 80 dollars an hour ahead.

Originally Posted by buzzpat (Post 1123099)

Random observation #167.
1) no Do Not Disturb sign and

Originally Posted by Doug Masters (Post 1123112)

Thats insulting.

Originally Posted by TheManager (Post 1123235)

And just to expand on this, and not for your sake nut.

DPA support is like playing with gas. It might not hurt you until there is a spark.

Like an AMR acquistion spark.

They have 10734 pilots. 10734 APA pilots whose back is up against the wall. Everyone remember what that feels like??. Put them along with 3,000 or so DPA pilots and we have a real Goat F%&* Jamboree. It would make the USAir/AmWest/USAPA saga look like a friendly company picnic.

That being said though, DALPA needs change desperately.

Originally Posted by TheManager (Post 1123246)

And perhaps the spark.

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 1123138)

5 percent at signing and 4 percent each year through this month. Contract expires 31 Dec 2012. Openers will be exchanged in April. Total raises in LOA 19 equaled 17 percent without compounding.

Originally Posted by Sink r8 (Post 1123172)

Why? Using the numbers above, if we have 100 737-900ER's coming, and 40 757's retiring, I can stomach that. Can't you?

I'm not saying I know how the trade will unfold, but using the numbers in the post you were responding to, I wouldn't shed a tear over a transaction that yields 60 new mainline airframes.