You are a real piece of work.

 

Exactly. (filler)

 

I have to be honest, I thought they'd offer something like 3%. So 0% does sound insulting. Of course, it's a game. DALPA probably wants X% and the company wants 0% so there will be some meeting in the middle.

 

Sorry PD, but I'm calling bovine defecation. Section 3 openers have only been conceptional in nature and no payrates have been exchanged as of yet.

 

That was my understanding also. If they did discuss section 3 the only day would have been last Thursday. There is a update out detailing each section discussed through Wednesday and section 3 was not one of them. The company did open for zero in contract 2012.

 

Sailing is absolutely correct that section 3 likely hasn't been formerly discussed yet.

I was referring to the notorious c12k opener of zero.

Point I'm trying to make is:

Why would the company EVER open with anything other than zero?

Yea, it's insulting but it's just good negotiating tactics and just business. Hope ALPA opens at a 100% pay increase and we can meet at 50%

 

You mean on the conceptual opener correct? So they didn't mention pay on a conceptual opener? Big Deal. What matters is first, what they open at when they offer a specific proposal for Section 3, if a modification to PS is included in that rate, and second, and most importantly, what the details are when they TA the contract. IE both sides agree to it.

As for trading specific proposals, my rep told me that what the Contrails state is exactly what the MEC has been told, and section 3 has not had any proposals made to his knowledge. He also said the MEC has not seen the opener from the company, but that he would not be shocked if pay rates were not mentioned under their section 3 in their conceptual opener.

Why would the company open 3 when they know we are going to bring it up? Same holds true for why we didn't open sick leave? Lose no sleep over it.

This is the last update, and in his words, what the MEC had been told.


Contrails 7
April 8, 2015

Weekly Negotiations Update #2

This is the second in a series of weekly Contrails designed to provide information on the progress of contract negotiations between the Delta pilots and the Company. This update covers the week of March 30 – April 3, 2015.

Last week we continued a robust meeting schedule. The Negotiating Committee met for four days of direct negotiations with the Company beginning Monday, March 30th. Both sides are still fleshing out specifics from their respective contract openers. Our contract opener, like the Company’s, was conceptual, and the initial part of our negotiations involves discussions to help each side understand the other side’s particular issues and rationale for proposals.

During the first two weeks we exchanged initial proposals on the following sections:

1. Section 4: Minimum Pay and Credit Guarantees
2. Section 5: Lodging and Expenses
3. Section 7: Vacations
4. Section 8: Deadheading
5. Section 11: Training
6. Section 12: Hours of Service
7. Section 13: Leaves of Absence
8. Section 16: Crew Augmentation and International Operations
9. Section 21: Furlough and Recall
10. Section 22: Filling of Vacancies
11. Section 23: Scheduling
12. Section 24: General
13. Section 25: Medical, Dental, Life Insurance, and Other Benefits
14. Section 26: Retirement and Disability Benefits

Much of the initial work resulted in additional data requests. We want as much information as possible so that we can do our own independent analysis to better understand the Company’s positions (see Contrails 5 – How Much Does a Proposal Cost). Our subject matter experts play an important role in this analysis and are critical to our process. Similarly, we provide background information to the Company to clarify our intentions to them.

The direct meetings have included the members of your Negotiating Committee, and our own in-house ALPA professional negotiators (we previewed one of our negotiators in our Spring 2014 Widget). The Company side often consists of Steve Dickson, SVP Flight Operations, former EVP Mike Campbell, and Brendan Branon, Managing Director – Labor Relations, among others.

The Negotiating Committee spent a significant amount of time with subject matter experts from the Training, Retirement and Insurance, and Scheduling committees refining our data requests and analyzing data received from the Company. As we have described in other publications, much of the work in negotiations takes place away from the negotiating table (see Contrails 4 – What Happens at a Negotiating Session at https://dal.alpa.org under the Negotiations Contract 2015 banner).

The Committee also met with our longtime legal advisors, the New York City law firm of Cohen, Weiss & Simon LLP, to continue preparing our Section 1 (Scope) proposal that will be presented in the coming weeks.

We have no meetings scheduled with the Company this week, due to pre-planned absences of several key members on both the ALPA and Company negotiating teams. However, neither the Negotiating Committee nor the subject matter experts are taking the week off. Instead, this week will be spent analyzing Company proposals made thus far, and honing our own proposals.

It may seem as though things are moving quickly, and with our commitment, and that of the Company, they are certainly moving faster than Section 6 negotiations experienced by most other pilot groups. However, all of this is the result of your input, a great deal of preparation over the past year, a lot of hard work by committee members and your representatives, and the Company’s willingness to negotiate in good faith. We are following our governance, your priorities, and the unanimous direction the Negotiating Committee received from your representatives.

What can you do? Answering one of the questions put to him, our own professional negotiator put it best: “When management comes to grips with and understands that the Negotiating Committee is truly speaking on behalf of a unified Delta pilot group, we have the opportunity to maximize our leverage to negotiate the best possible outcome.”

Thanks for staying informed. You can connect to your union at https://dal.alpa.org, look under the Negotiations Contract 2015 banner, and follow our progress from input thru membership ratification.

 

Curious. Why do you find that "insulting" yet go on to acknowledge that it's "just good negotiating tactics and just business"?

You really do seem fairly level headed in this, and I find that use of the term "insulting" interesting for you

 

You gotta admit tsquare, that was pretty funny.

Carl

 

Doesn't insult me. If I were Campbell, I'd start there too. Simple game theory.

Just hope we start at a ridiculously high rate as that is what game theory suggests we would do.

Insulting will be coming back with a TA that isn't vetted by the MEC and does not meet our minimums, like last time.