Details on Delta TA
04-13-2015 | 05:41 PM
#3661
The Brown Dot +1
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,775
Likes: 0
From: 777B
Didn't they get a carve out for the large rjs?
I think the real lesson here is for the regional lifers. The surviving DCI rj operators are being decided. The non-selected DCI operator crews will be looking for jobs at the selected carriers.
I think the real lesson here is for the regional lifers. The surviving DCI rj operators are being decided. The non-selected DCI operator crews will be looking for jobs at the selected carriers.
04-13-2015 | 06:07 PM
#3662
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 335
Likes: 0
You lose credibility for your lack of reading comprehension. You lose even more when you make assertions of fact without being able to back them up. And who is "we all" and what gives you the right to speak for all of them? You may be right, or you may not be, but sorry if I'm not sold on your claims just because you say so. Have a good night sir.
04-13-2015 | 06:28 PM
#3663
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
Karnak & Falcon-
You lose credibility by trying to claim the C2012 process was not manipulated by a small group of DALPA's permanent apparatchiks. We all saw what happened.
The MEC reps got out-maneuvered. Nobody's saying it was illegal or even immoral. It was just good old fashioned hardball politics. Our reps were totally unprepared for it. They never knew what hit 'em.
I hope they are ready this time because a lot of those same players are still in the game.
You lose credibility by trying to claim the C2012 process was not manipulated by a small group of DALPA's permanent apparatchiks. We all saw what happened.
The MEC reps got out-maneuvered. Nobody's saying it was illegal or even immoral. It was just good old fashioned hardball politics. Our reps were totally unprepared for it. They never knew what hit 'em.
I hope they are ready this time because a lot of those same players are still in the game.
04-13-2015 | 07:21 PM
#3664
Back on TDY
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 12,487
Likes: 0
From: 747-400 Captain
This again? Standard straw man arguments of every single DALPA apologist back then. So here we go again: The reps were not too dumb to know what they voted for. The reps were precisely and purposefully put in a very tough position by the MEC administration. That position was to either vote for a TA that did not meet their direction to the administration or the pilots' surveys, or vote down the TA and start again with an all new negotiating committee. The reps made the best of two very bad choices.
See above.
I know this from my reps and the reps of other bases as told to me by friends from other bases. There is no question that happened. None.
Feel free to join Karnak and Falcon in defending that MEC administration. Lots of people here remember exactly what happened...despite this occasional attempt to revise history.
Almost all of it very one sided, and some flat out misleading.
Again, nobody said you were. You're the only one making that accusation as shown by the beginning of your post. Most of the DALPA apologists follow this exact same template. Throw out a completely false premise, then put forth a passionate fight against your own false premise. Imagine the coincidence.
Carl
See above.
Feel free to join Karnak and Falcon in defending that MEC administration. Lots of people here remember exactly what happened...despite this occasional attempt to revise history.
Almost all of it very one sided, and some flat out misleading.
Again, nobody said you were. You're the only one making that accusation as shown by the beginning of your post. Most of the DALPA apologists follow this exact same template. Throw out a completely false premise, then put forth a passionate fight against your own false premise. Imagine the coincidence.
Carl
04-14-2015 | 04:21 AM
#3667
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 852
Likes: 0
"Process!" cried the losers.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
04-14-2015 | 05:18 AM
#3668
Works Every Weekend
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,506
Likes: 0
From: 737 ATL
Regarding what happened with C2012, I will quote Hillary. "At this point, what difference does it make?".
My only objective in posting about this is to urge caution and hope the reps keep the administration on a much shorter leash this time or the same thing could happen again. The reps could wake up one morning and read in the paper that the Delta pilots have a new contract.
Voting it down or sending it back for modifications is far more difficult after those headlines have run.
That's the lesson of C2012. Sorry if that offends some people.
My only objective in posting about this is to urge caution and hope the reps keep the administration on a much shorter leash this time or the same thing could happen again. The reps could wake up one morning and read in the paper that the Delta pilots have a new contract.
Voting it down or sending it back for modifications is far more difficult after those headlines have run.
That's the lesson of C2012. Sorry if that offends some people.
04-14-2015 | 05:25 AM
#3669
ready for mo money
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
From: Left Behind
"Process!" cried the losers.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
b. those reps were spineless and should be gone if they cant own up to their lack of action to do something about it if process wasnt followed
i think the process was followed but that we settled for too little too early
04-14-2015 | 05:43 AM
#3670
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,039
Likes: 0
From: 7ERB
"Process!" cried the losers.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
Pilots who voted for C2012 were asked if the deal was acceptable, and not how it was achieved. Regardless of how much Carl asserts otherwise, the only two possible reasons they found it acceptable are:
A. It was an acceptable deal.
B. We are clueless, spineless, dupes who can't read, listen, or ask questions.
The "process" was subject to an aggressive organizing drive by DPA. The complaints about it by Carl's reps, and mine, were heard.
The simplest conclusion here is that Carl's views aren't shared by most Delta pilots. That's not a slam. Somebody has to occupy the fringes of the bell curve.
We are people, most will tend to follow. We have a pack rat mentality and will believe what we want to believe.
I have talked to many that voted for. Most said they trust their reps and there was no need to go through the legal jargon.
C2012 was an example of following your leader to the trough.
Hopefully, with this new leadership
more people can think for themselves.Good luck,
TEN
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