The problem with all of these "throw away" items is that our "union" doesn't demand that they are thrown away.....
"Sure" says DALPA, " but we DEMAND another nickel per diem for that!"

 

Run for rep. Show them how it's done. But no, that would be too hard. it is much easier to throw rocks from your keyboard.
Every guy that I have talked to that went into service has said the same thing. they never realized how different it would be once you see the process.

 

I hear you James-- "that's how it's always been done!" "We must give into the company needs"... When does the pilot "needs" get addressed? Why in every section 6 negotiation does ALPA start out by addressing the company "needs"? Why not start out addressing OUR needs first, then we can look at helping the company out based on what they've done for us?? I know James- "it's never been done that way!!"

 

I think you are being overly dramatic. That being said, it sucks but they write the checks. I don't know what the company's 'needs' are any more than you do. For that matter, you don't truly know what the pilots' 'needs' are either. You only know what YOU want.

I find it extremely amusing at this point though that so soon after the housecleaning that occurred after TA15 that many of the same people on here are already calling for the heads of those that they placed in those positions. That tells me that those yelling the loudest are agenda driven to see them fail so that they can make yet another run at Tim's Toxic Rangers.

It has nothing to do with how it has been done in the past. It has more to do with a clear perception of current reality and view of history (think of the AAL 'demands' and where it got them for all those years that many on this board clearly ignore). If you are good with being in limbo for 3,4,5 years, then continue with this logic. If you think that being obstinate and saying that because we deserve this or that and we will say no until we get it, then you are as naive as a housecat. They write the checks. Time is on their side.

Fire away. this should be good.

 

Empirically, we disagreed overwhelmingly with those who told us there was no more money. A bunch of new guys DID run. The company found more money. It seems pretty clear that the guys last year were dead wrong. They stamped their feet that we were p*ssy whiners and rocket surgeons, and again empirically, they weren't right.

 

If we followed your logic, there would be no reason to negotiate. Just take the first company offer because they hold all the cards. For that matter, why would we need a collective bargaining agent?

 

Is that what you got out of what I said?

 

I am fine with the current contract for the next 2-3 years.. I would like a better contract, but will happily stay with the current contract in the abscence of a better contract. No to PS carve-outs, no to worse JV and rj scope, no to worse SL... Quit trading away dollar bills and getting back nickels! I know- "always been done that way!!"

 

No doubt. That is all true. So carry the logic forward then. How long do we keep saying no then, because as long as we do the logic says the potential to get more is better.

 

The December counter of 22/7/7 was demonstrably reasonable. The logic test you should apply is "if the proposal is reasonable, why capitulate now?" The failure of your hypothesis is that our offer is unreasonable and eventually we'll be called on it by the NMB and end up losing. The truth is on our side. Be confident in that.