SWA solidly passes their TA2

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11-08-2016 | 02:43 PM

#31

Scoop

Moderator

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 7,253

Likes: 95

From: DAL 330

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf

The money isn't the only thing in the TA that holds importance. We all do it for the money. Some want to work less or control their schedule more. A little disingenuous, I think.

Everything in the PWA is very important, but different Pilots prioritize things differently. Some may put more importance to scheduling flexibility - and that is their choice. Others may put more importance on the pay rates and that is also their choice.

I do not begrudge anyone for prioritizing scheduling flexibility, vacation, sick leave issues or medical benefits etc. over pay rates - that is their choice. Why is it OK for guys who prioritize these items OK to belittle a fellow Pilot for prioritizing pay-rates as most important?

I really take issue with guys telling other Pilots who prioritize pay rates that they don't care about QOL. QOL means many different things to many Pilots. I would be very hesitant to tell a Pilot who prioritizes pay-rates that he does not care about QOL - how would I know what defines QOL for him?

Scoop

11-08-2016 | 02:48 PM

#32

FIIGMO

Sho me da money!

Joined: Feb 2007

Posts: 947

Likes: 0

From: B25, Left

Quote:

Originally Posted by flyguy81

No they're not going away. That's not getting back into Pandora's box. There's a reason UAL has nearly double the widebody pilots....minimal JV's.

I am ****ed DAL does not have the wide body fleet I feel should be there for MY career progression. Seriously it sucks, but (just ask Denny, we shared a beer over this topic) DAL is healthy and positioned to handle a down turn. AAL UAL not so much....it is not ideal but I like our position for the long run rather than UAL and AAL....

Plus a nice place to work...........

11-08-2016 | 02:50 PM

#33

Trip7

Gets Weekends Off

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 6,149

Likes: 210

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoop

Everything in the PWA is very important, but different Pilots prioritize things differently. Some may put more importance to scheduling flexibility - and that is their choice. Others may put more importance on the pay rates and that is also their choice.

I do not begrudge anyone for prioritizing scheduling flexibility, vacation, sick leave issues or medical benefits etc. over pay rates - that is their choice. Why is it OK for guys who prioritize these items OK to belittle a fellow Pilot for putting more prioritizing pay-rates as most important?

I really take issue with guys telling other Pilots who prioritize pay rates that they don't care about QOL. QOL means many different things to many Pilots. I would be very hesitant to tell a Pilot who prioritizes pay-rates that he does not care about QOL - how would I know what defines QOL for him?

Scoop

Well said.

A nice house with a pool and 3 car garage, maxed out 401k, maxed out HSA, and a solid emergency fund is great QOL to me. I'm not going to get that sitting at home drinking beer 17 days a month after over half a decade as an RJ FO.

11-08-2016 | 03:28 PM

#34

notEnuf

Racketeer

Joined: Mar 2015

Posts: 13,242

Likes: 697

From: N60.4858 W149.9327

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoop

I agree with your characterization with one caveat.

Would it be appropriate to reduce pay rates to increase QOL? Now we are being asked to do the opposite.

Or... If pay were to be conceded to a lower amount, would that be acceptable for an 18% decrease in time obligated to Delta that compounds to 30% in 3 years?

11-08-2016 | 04:00 PM

#35

Doug Masters

Weekend and Holiday Pilot

Joined: Jan 2007

Posts: 1,152

Likes: 1

From: Sippin' at the Troubadour

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trip7

Well said.

A nice house with a pool and 3 car garage, maxed out 401k, maxed out HSA, and a solid emergency fund is great QOL to me. I'm not going to get that sitting at home drinking beer 17 days a month after over half a decade as an RJ FO.

Wait...are you judging me?

11-08-2016 | 04:16 PM

#36

Scoop

Moderator

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 7,253

Likes: 95

From: DAL 330

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf

I agree with your characterization with one caveat.

Would it be appropriate to reduce pay rates to increase QOL? Now we are being asked to do the opposite.

Or... If pay were to be conceded to a lower amount, would that be acceptable for an 18% decrease in time obligated to Delta that compounds to 30% in 3 years?

Would it be appropriate to reduce pay rates to increase QOL? Now we are being asked to do the opposite.

Absolutely - if that is what you prioritize. Just as the opposite is OK, if that is what an individual Pilot wants.

And you know what - If the majority of Pilots see us as trading pay rates for QOL and don't like it the TA will fail - just like last time.

If the majority decide that this TA is in their best interests it will pass.

Scoop

11-08-2016 | 04:20 PM

#37

notEnuf

Racketeer

Joined: Mar 2015

Posts: 13,242

Likes: 697

From: N60.4858 W149.9327

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trip7

Are you saying you can't do that now? Do you need the 18% and this TA to achieve that? 17 days a month off would allow me to do a lot of my real life wishes. Fishing, golf, travel, coach, volunteer, build my own business, manage investments, spend time with the family, relax, and of course drink beer.

I think we need a new thread.

Ex RJ drivers video gaming from the couch in their PJs while drinking beer and solving the worlds problems via social media.

11-08-2016 | 04:22 PM

#38

notEnuf

Racketeer

Joined: Mar 2015

Posts: 13,242

Likes: 697

From: N60.4858 W149.9327

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoop

You are not being honest, it would never be acceptable to cut pay under any circumstance outside of bankruptcy. I feel the same way about QOL.

11-08-2016 | 04:29 PM

#39

Scoop

Moderator

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 7,253

Likes: 95

From: DAL 330

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf

You are not being honest, it would never be acceptable to cut pay under any circumstance outside of bankruptcy. I feel the same way about QOL.

OK - Since it does not matter I say - I will stop posting on this topic and you can argue my points for me.

I bet you win the argument.

Aren't you the one arguing that we shouldn't be concerned about pay rates and should prioritize on QOL. Now you say no one would ever accept a trade of pay for QOL.

Scoop

11-08-2016 | 04:38 PM

#40

JamesBond

Gets Weekends Off

Joined: May 2015

Posts: 7,292

Likes: 0

From: A350 Both

Quote:

Originally Posted by notEnuf

The money isn't the only thing in the TA that holds importance. We all do it for the money. Some want to work less or control their schedule more. A little disingenuous, I think.

No, disingenuous is raising all this hell over a ****ing sick note.